Edit: Everyone, please be careful if you decide to confront a TIM in a space for women. I’m going to get myself an alarm and a self-defense weapon like a taser or pepper spray.
I realize I will likely be kicked out of establishments, harassed, threatened or even arrested for doing what businesses, universities and governments will not. That’s okay. The further and further encroachment of transgender ideology has shown me that resistance must start somewhere.
I am posting this to encourage other women—and men who care about women—to do so as well. I’m also posting because writing this out and telling myself I am going to do it prepares me to be ready.
Will we sometimes miss men who appear female? Probably. Will we end up accidentally bothering women who look masculine? Possibly. But no one is perfect. And we must remember where the blame lies with regard to unintended harassment of masculine women: It lies squarely with trans activists for handing men access to women’s spaces. If transgenderism were not being increasingly accepted, it would be assumed that masculine-looking women are female.
I’d like to thank a Twitter account whose name I can’t recall for giving me the courage to say this by urging women to vocally order men out of their private spaces. It might have been @LabelFreeBrands, I don’t know. I hope all women who are with us will rise up against transgender tyranny and tell men who think they can violate our privacy, our dignity, our sex-based rights to GET THE FUCK OUT.
82 comments
If transgenderism were not being increasingly accepted, it would be assumed that masculine-looking women are female.
yes!
One of these women, who said she was often harassed as a man, absolutely refused to believe that TRAs could be at the root of why this was happening. Nope, angry and scared women vulnerable to harassment or assault who’ve finally had enough are the villains here.
I do not understand this. I don’t get why she isn’t angry at trans activists who caused men to be allowed in women’s spaces in the first place.
true. I have a enby friend. I saw that she complained about being asked to leave from the women's room and took it as a sign that transpeople need more rights. But the more males we see in our single-sex the more we are going to question everyone.
Is enby really what we call nonbimboified women these days
Non-binary.
Incredible that some women make other women’s safety all about themselves, when we should be sticking together. It’s sickening.
Please define "masculine-looking women".
Please define it in a way that doesn't mean Lesbian.
Here ya go! https://medium.com/@littleoceandrop/the-unsatisfied-masculine-woman-dd5b70a14ead
....women who are built more like males? Very tall, large bones, square jaw, etc.
I have the feeling you somehow are taking this comment personally.
Edit: @maeven to answer your reply.
OH MY GOODNESS, why would any lesbian take it personally???
I feel like masculine looking women could be anyone who is purposefully or NOT purposefully more “male” looking... sure it could be butch lesbians but it could also be straight tomboys (like myself), women with short hair and loose clothes, buff af women, women with masculine features....
I think instead of being confrontational, just loudly and obviously wait outside the door for them to leave. And make sure to warn other women that there seems to be a man in our bathroom/changing room. Then he can do the walk of shame past us all as he leaves.
I don't really like the idea of escalating the situation more than it already is. I also don't think we should confront people directly if there's a reasonable basis to assume that they are actually female.
Also, the last thing we need is to be filmed and put on YouTube where these creeps can see and dox us. Or to help TIMs garner sympathy via crying about their "abuse" on Twitter.
We cannot let them manipulate us. I can’t control how they see my telling a man to leave women’s spaces alone, and I’m not going to worry about it.
As for doxing, well, they may. No one said rebellion was safe.
Yeah, I think it would be a more effective message to have a line of women waiting to use their own restrooms and change rooms. I also wouldn't want to be assaulted by some mentally unstable TIM, even if he deserves being called out.
If there were a queue and I spotted a TIM in it (I'm not very good with confrontation) I would try the clueless lady trying to be helpful route and let them this line was for the Women's bathroom and the men's can be found 'over there'
With respect, I’m not going to stand outside a bathroom meant for my gender, waiting for the man violating my privacy to finish before I can use it.
It's important we don't stoop to using their convoluted language and terms, I've started using Unisex instead of "Gender Neutral". I would say bathroom for my "sex", differences between the "Sexes".
Again with respect, I don’t care to distinguish between sexual activity and biological sex, or use more syllables than I have to. I also think that distinguishing between biological sex and gender gives TRAs ground as it can be taken to mean that sex and sexual/gender identity are two different things.
I also want to add that we are not escalating the situation by demanding our men-free spaces. That’s what TRAs want you to think. They are the only ones causing problems, by demanding the right to violate our privacy and endanger our safety.
Ok I change my answer, unlike this approach way better.
My advice is that if you do this, be sure to do this without screaming, yelling, name-calling, etc. Because if you do that, then you play right into the messaging of what TRAs claim that we do. That there are these unhinged, screaming TERFs accosting random poor innocent TIMs in bathrooms who just want to pee. We have every right to enforce the boundaries of our spaces, but I think we have to be smart about how we do it.
If I were to run into this situation (and if it were a mall or smthng) I would likely try to not engage them myself and instead try and find security personnel or any staff and ask them to do something about the leery man in the womens bathroom.
I understand where you’re coming from, Wack. I’ll tag you in my response.
Ha. Then you'll be asked to leave, I assume. So tired of this BS.
Good advice.
I imagine it will be difficult not to get emotional and yell. This is very scary.
You're very brave! Certainly braver than I am. As a masculine looking woman - I look like a teenage boy on a good day - I have a tip for you: try and say "Excuse me," first and hear their voice. A lot of times when I'm out in public, people can't tell my gender. But I have a very feminine voice, and it occasionally confuses people who assumed I was male when they hear me speak.
I actually did have the bathroom thing happen. A woman saw me walk out of the ladies' room and said "That's a women's bathroom!". Not quite understanding what she was getting at, I said "I know!" and she dropped the subject because my voice instantly outed me.
What about men on hormones or who have trained their voices to sound feminine? You could tell they’re male from their height and bone structure, but be fooled by their voices.
I understand what you’re saying, and I’m sorry trans activists have forced it to come to this. I hope if I misjudge a woman’s gender, she’ll say she’s on my side about single-sex spaces but she really is a woman.
I'm a woman who gets mistaken for a guy in the ladies room often. It's a very minor inconvenience that only takes a few seconds to clear up. Worst case scenario, the woman you mistook for a man will be visibly or audibly annoyed.
And don't worry about the voice training thing. Results are extremely hit or miss and even the most convincing men's voices don't exactly hit the mark. The majority of the time, you'll be able to tell they're a man by the combination of their features (voice, height, bone structure, porportions, fat distribution, gait).
Very true. I'm not saying it's foolproof, but I think voice can be an indicator. If you heard my voice, you wouldn't doubt for a second I was female, even if I do look like a stocky teenage boy.
I have to prioritize all women’s safety. I know it’s uncomfortable to be accused of being a man using women’s spaces. But that’s more reason to fight them.
Been replying to a lot of your comments today, lovely to have an actual discussion of these things (I'm new to Ovarit).
So what I've experienced (with playing many online games with random people with mics) is that men always either sound stereotypically male or overly cutesy-feminine, the first is obvious when you hear it and the latter is just infuriating when you hear it because it just sounds so mocking. I haven't come across a TIM that didn't sound like one of these but I have seen some youtube videos and find that TIMs who pass and also have a normal sounding women's voice are incredibly uncommon.
godspeed. i hope you are 5'11" or taller. Maybe I'll try this too and just play dumb about knowing the amounts of power they have. maybe i'll just complain at the front desk that there's a dick-haver in the bathroom
Also, he could be gone by then, and knowing the fear of “transphobia” as well as general refusal to see a problem, not much would be done anyway.
I would like to make sure it is emphasized to the TIM in question what he already knows—that he is not entitled to women’s spaces. I want other women to see someone taking the initiative to publicly demand our rights.
Edit: @wack
The danger is here regardless. It’s a matter of whether we choose to confront TIMs, or continue to accept them in our private spaces where we are most vulnerable.
Thanks for the tag! I'm about the same height as you and my build is also very small, I'm close to being underweight (BMI-wise) by only a couple of pounds, so actually confronting a TIM would be a very cautious action as we all know many men can get irrationally angry and violent very quickly.
No, I’m 5’2 3/4. Oh well.
My mom is smaller than you and I can totally see her being righteous and then playing the I'm a little old lady card.
Our size is on our side, in a way. People react emotionally and want to protect those they see as vulnerable.
your point about masculine women is so true. to preface, i personally think that masc women are still very obviously women 99% of the time, if not at first glance then definitely after a double take. however, if bathrooms were actually single sex, you wouldn't even have to do a double take cause you'd assume that everyone in there is a woman. nowadays, though, you cant assume that - men can and do enter our spaces freely. knowing that there's likely male people in your supposed safe space is naturally going to make you hyper aware of anyone who even might be male, whereas this wouldnt be a problem if you could just safely assume that every masculine looking person in a bathroom is still a woman.
Yes. Exactly.
You're right. You're exactly correct. When the time comes that I'm in a public washroom again I DGAF if I get banned, I'm doing the same. If I'm lucky hubs is there in the same resto and I can text him to be my enforcer. He already is in DGAF mode about being banned.
Hubs sounds great!
He's just super practical and also listens when I explain these things. Once I explained that if I punch him in the face I'll bruise his face and break my hand, and if he punches me in the face he'll bruise his hand and break my face, he went super quiet and after awhile said smth like "holy fuck noone told me that. Boys need to be told that".
awesome hubs!! Who knows maybe he can be your token transwoman lol. "of course i’m not being transphobic, look at my beautiful trans wife!" cut to perfectly normal looking dude
Be careful, though. IIRC a woman was stabbed a few months ago in Recife (Brazil) after she confronted a trans woman who was using a women's restroom in a bar...
That’s horrifying. Thank you for the warning. I’ll be sure to confront them only in well-lit buildings where an assault would be noticed.
I should also get an alarm, and a taser if it’s legal where I live.
MOVE, Prick, Get out the way Get out the way, prick GET OUT THE WAY
Right?? Imagine our actually having to wait for a man to finish relieving himself, in spaces that should be only for us.
I really don't think this is the solution. For many reasons. If they're actually dangerous, then confronting them will put women in MORE danger. And encouraging women to do something that will absolutely result in our butch sisters being harassed and bullied even more than they already are - is just horrible. Butch women need more allies and GC should be a natural ally of women who don't conform to feminine standards, not an enemy.
We can discourage them to use our facilities by putting up posters and stickers in bathrooms and changing rooms. We can enter bathrooms together for safety.
We can't just throw caution to the wind and butch women under the bus and call that feminism.
GNC women do not look male to me. Stone butches are still feminine to me, because they are female! I think everyone here knows a TIM when they see one. I do worry about safety, though. I also think that danger is unavoidable at this point though because our rights are being trampled all over. I don't think women will get their rights back without threat of violent opposition from those who disagree with us.
Butch women have stories. All GNC women have stories of being mistaken as men, probably. They get harassed in women's rooms and this will lead to more of it.
Your own personal assurance doesn't help much when I already KNOW this happens because I listen to butch women.
but butch women dont look like TIMs. TIMs I have seen in person use an extreme amount of "gender expression" to try to blend in, but they still looked obviously male. I do not think kicking TIMs out of female restrooms will lead to more butches being kicked out.
Well said, and I agree.
Thanks. I saw all the supporting comments on this and felt like I was in crazy town.
I feel like if anyone were to do this it would need to be in a well lit generally safe area where there are plenty of other women around, I likely wouldn't attempt it as I'm certainly not the strongest or biggest woman around but if I did it would feel somewhat validating for everyone around me to see a TIM get angry at me (5'3" 110lbs~) for asking them to leave the women's bathroom.
then again I would only ever attempt it if the country/city I'm in doesn't have "Gender Affirming" laws pertaining to TIMs being allowed in sex-segregated bathrooms.
I tagged you in an earlier comment to answer. Also I have been told here by one of these women that being mistaken for a man is a minor inconvenience. She explains she really is female and they all go on with their day.
I’ve said before: don’t let TRAs shift the blame. Any bothering of women believed to be men is fully thanks to them. They want you to believe that claiming our spaces leads to harassment and violence against women, that we need to accept men in our spaces because those men might really be female. Don’t fall for it.
The thing is: we have to stand up. Pedophiles like Jonathan “Jessica” Yaniv cannot be anywhere near children. We can’t risk a young girl being traumatized for life all because a man is inconvenienced he can’t “validate” himself.
My advice as someone who used to fight with guys: research and study illegal moves in UFC fights – they will do serious damage. Additionally, punch/jab the assailant's throat. Try lightly pressing the edge of your hand (form it like you would a karate chop) against your throat; see how uncomfortable it is even without force. It’s super jarring when there’s real energy behind it (this scene depicts it fairly well). Good luck!
Thanks for this.
And thank you also for being decisive. Without attacking members who disagree, the time for “nice” tactics is over (also, they’re effective really only if a lot of women use them at the same time, and most are not actively fighting back). No one else will stand up for us. We have to rely on ourselves and each other.