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Can we acknowledge that trans identified females are the ones mostly responsible for the erasure of womens identities?

There seems to be some sort of distortion where people seem to think that its merely male fetishists who generate this erasure. Those people can easily be dismissed and humiliated out of public discourse.

The AGP men who feel "violated" , "left out" and discriminated against because women exhibit traits or talk about issues that exclude them: pregnancy, periods, cervical cancer, etc dont have the legitimacy to erase women as much as we think they can because the backlash would be too great and normal people would easily point to the ones theyre supporting and accommodating because theyre kind and empathetic people: TIF's.

TIF's are the ones whose criticisms are seen as legitimate. That "cis" women arent acknowledging that she's a man with a vagina and you need to respect that and we're clearly wrong and should be "inclusive" and stop "gatekeeping" womenhood. They work in tandem with the AGP, HSTS and any other transexual.

Theyre the ones who knowingly offer their thin veneer of legitimacy as the point of the spear to attack women's rights with. Feminine hygiene companies bending over backwards to "accommodate" them by erasing women and pretending men have periods too (im sure you've seen AGP's say this but it's only because they feel they can since TIF's are transexuals and theyre from the same community.

Same with vaginal cancer, pregnancy and any other issue. Just look at the relationships other transexuals have with their "former community". HSTS people, who some think are harmless, have a psychotic level of hatred for gay males because gay males can easily invalidate their identity and know exactly who they are and where theyre coming from. The biggest danger and threat to HSTS is the gay male community. Any other group of people will just see HSTS people as weird, strange but theyre empathetic enough to tolerate them and theyre grateful for that because there's a comfortable "foreign-ness" where the person doesnt understand them and has to rely on them to lecture them on their identity..but a gay man would laugh in their face and tell them how they went wrong and why theyre delusional and violate any boundaries of "foreign-ness" because a gay man just sees an HSTS as a gay man in a wig. And theyre enemies because it's conversion theraphy, HSTS people know it and openly acknowledge it on twitter and still push for it.

Straight and lesbian women who identify as the other sex have the same dynamic with us as HSTS people have with the gay male community. It's conversion theraphy and they know it and still push for it. The AGP men are laughable, scary, theyre clowns and gain the most attention but if you peruse through TIF subreddits, theyre not innocent, confused kind women who failed, and wish to fail alone and isolate themselves and not have their mistakes spread. They practice conversion theraphy as well and we're being blinded to it. The TIF's who identify as gay males can be just as rapey, hateful, homophobic and aggressive as the AGP "lesbians". We're letting a nest of conversion theraphy go unnoticed and the insane part is...it's conversion theraphy for straight women to identify as gay men even though no gay man would want this? These transexual communities all work together and are just as bad as the AGP men. Not only do TIF's push conversion theraphy on gay men through the whole "sleep with me or you're a bigot" rhetoric, but they also sneakily push conversion theraphy on other straight women.

You can see how their their subreddits work, how they welcome straight women struggling with their identities and how these TIF's feed on their vulnerability and desperately try to convince them that they really are gay men stuck in a woman's body. And the horrible part is, you can see it work because gay men have a versatility in their culture and identity where they have extremely masculine men and very feminine "twinks", so you can choose from a full buffet of options and simply claim you're some sort of "gay feminine twink".

here's a link to some tweets which i dont think have been posted here before.

https://twitter.com/stilltish/status/1284443676144435202?lang=en

Can we acknowledge that trans identified females are the ones mostly responsible for the erasure of womens identities? There seems to be some sort of distortion where people seem to think that its merely male fetishists who generate this erasure. Those people can easily be dismissed and humiliated out of public discourse. The AGP men who feel "violated" , "left out" and discriminated against because women exhibit traits or talk about issues that exclude them: pregnancy, periods, cervical cancer, etc dont have the legitimacy to erase women as much as we think they can because the backlash would be too great and normal people would easily point to the ones theyre supporting and accommodating because theyre kind and empathetic people: TIF's. TIF's are the ones whose criticisms are seen as legitimate. That "cis" women arent acknowledging that she's a man with a vagina and you need to respect that and we're clearly wrong and should be "inclusive" and stop "gatekeeping" womenhood. They work in tandem with the AGP, HSTS and any other transexual. Theyre the ones who knowingly offer their thin veneer of legitimacy as the point of the spear to attack women's rights with. Feminine hygiene companies bending over backwards to "accommodate" them by erasing women and pretending men have periods too (im sure you've seen AGP's say this but it's only because they feel they can since TIF's are transexuals and theyre from the same community. Same with vaginal cancer, pregnancy and any other issue. Just look at the relationships other transexuals have with their "former community". HSTS people, who some think are harmless, have a psychotic level of hatred for gay males because gay males can easily invalidate their identity and know exactly who they are and where theyre coming from. The biggest danger and threat to HSTS is the gay male community. Any other group of people will just see HSTS people as weird, strange but theyre empathetic enough to tolerate them and theyre grateful for that because there's a comfortable "foreign-ness" where the person doesnt understand them and has to rely on them to lecture them on their identity..but a gay man would laugh in their face and tell them how they went wrong and why theyre delusional and violate any boundaries of "foreign-ness" because a gay man just sees an HSTS as a gay man in a wig. And theyre enemies because it's conversion theraphy, HSTS people know it and openly acknowledge it on twitter and still push for it. Straight and lesbian women who identify as the other sex have the same dynamic with us as HSTS people have with the gay male community. It's conversion theraphy and they know it and still push for it. The AGP men are laughable, scary, theyre clowns and gain the most attention but if you peruse through TIF subreddits, theyre not innocent, confused kind women who failed, and wish to fail alone and isolate themselves and not have their mistakes spread. They practice conversion theraphy as well and we're being blinded to it. The TIF's who identify as gay males can be just as rapey, hateful, homophobic and aggressive as the AGP "lesbians". We're letting a nest of conversion theraphy go unnoticed and the insane part is...it's conversion theraphy for straight women to identify as gay men even though no gay man would want this? These transexual communities all work together and are just as bad as the AGP men. Not only do TIF's push conversion theraphy on gay men through the whole "sleep with me or you're a bigot" rhetoric, but they also sneakily push conversion theraphy on other straight women. You can see how their their subreddits work, how they welcome straight women struggling with their identities and how these TIF's feed on their vulnerability and desperately try to convince them that they really are gay men stuck in a woman's body. And the horrible part is, you can see it work because gay men have a versatility in their culture and identity where they have extremely masculine men and very feminine "twinks", so you can choose from a full buffet of options and simply claim you're some sort of "gay feminine twink". here's a link to some tweets which i dont think have been posted here before. https://twitter.com/stilltish/status/1284443676144435202?lang=en

29 comments

[–] Omina_Sentenziosa 48 points (+49|-1)

I don' t think it' s only male fetishists that are doing it, but I don' t think female TRAs are the ones who are responsible the most. This push didn' t come from them, it came from men, the female ones are just followers. They definitely need to be blamed and some times are even more damaging than the male ones, and I agree that they can be as homophobic and anti-women as the worst male TRA, and I really don' t justify them in the least, not even if I take into considerationg socialization and soicety' s sexism. But I think that the ones who started it all should be considered the main culprits.

Also, the fact that feminine hygiene companies and orgs like PP are doing this erasure of women' s words isn' t really for TIFs and female NBs: they are saying they are doing it for them, but the reality is that they are doing it so that men are happy that femalehood is further detached from womanhood.

[–] Griffxx 8 points (+8|-0) Edited

PREACH 👏👏👏 👏👏. We saw this in r/GCDebateQT.

When Jos Truitt, Ed of Feministing, on the occasion of International Women's Day 2011, listed all these biological female experiences and said they were no longer "Women's Issues" because men could have babies too." That was the starter shot. They have always been behind the scenes. TIMs didn't want to be reminded they weren't female. TIFs didn't want to be reminded they were female.

There are TIFs especially in the UK who have been key in enacting or seeking legislation harmful to women, there's Stephen Whittle who founded Press for Change and was key in the original Gender Recognition Act 2004, also awarded an OBE. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Whittle

Also James Morton former head of Scottish Trans Alliance who has been very influential in many areas including getting males into women's prisons. https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/james-morton-trans-rights-trump-sex-vs-gender-battle-1427258

Then there is Freddy McConnell, 'seahorse dad' and Guardian columnist who has been working hard to remove the word mother from birth certificates not just for themselves but is also strongly aligned with the surrogacy lobby. Fortunately their attempt failed at the High Court and the Court of Appeal. https://metro.co.uk/2020/11/16/transgender-man-loses-bid-to-be-named-father-on-sons-birth-certificate-13603505/

Of course in the US you have Chase Strangio who I'm sure most are familiar with. In time you may see others.

I don't think it's helpful to play down the harm female TRAs can do. Sometimes I feel they get put forward for court challenges and other activism as a more sympathetic, palatable front for the interests behind them. I certainly feel this was the case with McConnell who had the support of the well funded surrogacy lobby and the trans lobby. Had McConnell been successful I expect it would have been utilised much more by men who want to usurp and disappear mothers than it would by transmen wanting to be named as father.

Anyone outside of the UK do read up on how influential some TIFs have been here, in some cases going back a few decades, because forewarned is forearmed.

I am not downplaying anything, I think zealots are very dangerous, especially if they are convinced that it is going to enhance their position.

I still don' t think that they started it all, and I believe that the ones who did, especially considering that they are responsible of abysmal things as well, hold a higher position of blame.

Yes I understand that. It wasn't meant as a criticism of your post which I agree with. I just want women especially those outside of the UK to be aware of the level of harmful legislation TIFs have been involved with in this country.

[–] SarahTheGreen 26 points (+26|-0)

How is it different from anorexia and other self-harm cultures? When you're in it, you want other people to go along with it because otherwise the house of cards will collapse. Also, how is it different from women being the ones to implement FGM? A quotation from a paper: "In such cases, male power is so pervasive that women preemptively facilitate men's coercive tactics."

At any rate, it's TIMs who have the money. TIFs by themselves would just be another minority on the internet, and probably wouldn't have such easy access to transitioning. Can you imagine if that kind of money and influence appropriated anorexia?

[–] Omina_Sentenziosa 10 points (+10|-0)

Give it time. I am half convinced that the next big fads will be transhumanis (which will definitely include something like anorexia) and pedophilia.

[–] PattyBouvier 25 points (+25|-0)

Can I just say how batshit it is that for some TiFs, a whole ass PREGNANCY isn’t the thing giving them dysphoria, but some nurse saying ‘breastfeeding’ instead of ‘chest feeding’ is??? Like it absolutely blows my mind

[–] zuubat 6 points (+6|-0)

Particularly specious considering that both men and women have breasts.

It's as though inflicting injury on women is never enough. They've got to add the insult on top of it.

Just because.

[–] bannedrui_resin 21 points (+21|-0)

I don't know who's responsible for most of the activism, and can't comment on broader patterns, but the TRAs/allies I know are women. They used to be good people. Now their callousness takes my breath away. They have endless pity and sympathy for men who identify as women and for women who identify as not-women. But there's nothing... just feigned incomprehension and mockery, when it comes to women generally.

It seems like the enbies and transmen want to escape the category "woman" as desperately as the transwomen want to get in. The enbies need us to stay in the category "woman", because if we all up and migrate to the category "genderless human", then the enbies won't be different from us any more--they won't have achieved any distance from the idea of us. And the transwomen need us to stay because if we all evacuate the category "woman", then they won't be similar to us anymore. One way or another they both rely on the majority of women/female people staying in the category "woman" in order to give it meaning and to make sense of their own self definitions.

[–] Jellyfishes 20 points (+20|-0)

When TIFs try to force gay men into dating them, they just get mocked and laughed off. Reddit has a gay subreddit (the name is Ask Gay Bros, I think) that is against TIFs and it has not been banned. Meanwhile an american TIM went to Japan and forced a lesbian bar (Gold Finger) to accept trans people. TIFs don't hold even a fraction of the power TIMs have.

Yes, what they do to gay men is unnaceptable and they deserve criticism, but there is no way they harm women more than TIMs. Males are the one who decided to render the word woman useless by changing its definition to "woman is anyone who identifies as one". They are even trying to change the meaning of biological female", claiming that HRT actually changes one's sex.

[–] Boudicaea 17 points (+17|-0) Edited

responsible for the erasure of womens identities

I don't "identify" as anything, to be clear. I am a woman so society treats me like a woman, because society treats women differently from men. I don't "identify" with my oppression. But would I like to be able to organize without men interfering-- yes.

Just pointing out that using "identity" in this way implies there is some choice about it. You can either live in reality or not. I'm not choosing to identify in any way; rather, I simply choose to live in reality.

[–] lulululululu 14 points (+14|-0)

Yeah, I have complicated feelings about this because while I feel like TIMs are responsible for most of the toxicity of gender ideology, TIFs (and enbies), not TIMs, were the ones who completely destroyed my women’s college and turned it into an “all oppressed genders college.” I attended my college at a time when TIFs and enbies were allowed to attend but TIMs were not; the former group not only were responsible for the push and the activism that made it possible for TIMs to attend, but also were the ones who would jump at anyone’s throat if they correctly described our women’s college as a women’s college (even though they willingly chose to attend knowing it was a women’s college so how is that our problem?) and bullied everyone into saying “siblings” instead of “women,” amongst other language changes to make all language at a WOMEN’S COLLEGE gender neutral. I even remember a time that the TIFs and the enbies to shut down a campus event about menstruation even though the people planning the event used 100% gender neutral language because it wasn’t “inclusive.” Again, there were no TIMs on the campus at the time, the TIFs and the enbies shut down the event on their own. To this day, now that TIMs are allowed, I believe that the number of TIMs at my alma mater is in the single digits while there are SO SO SO many TIFs and enbies.

Anyway, while I think that many of us on here are understandably paying more attention to TIMs, we also shouldn’t underestimate how dangerous some TIFs and enbies can be, not just in terms of women’s spaces but women’s safety... (one TIF at my college was a serial rapist.) I don’t have much sympathy for them anymore, even if they’re females, for how much they’ve turned on women and how much they spew misogyny dressed up in woke language (because if it’s aimed at “cis women” it’s apparently okay to say any awful thing about women).

[–] Flower_tsuji 12 points (+13|-1) Edited

The trans id females didn't make up any of the language- the TIM made it up and after they gaslight the woman and girls they parrot it off. Its not that most gc or radfem are deny that what they say is harmful, its the realization of who is actually leading and creating this rhetoric in the first place. This is the same sort of analysis that is done in any other feminist analysis. Just because mothers and female teacher may be the first people to educate other woman and girls and pass on sexist ideology they didn't come up with that ideology in the first place.

Its the difference between trying to cut the head of the snake, then just fighting the tail. In addition i've seen more people peak and get angry at the TIF in gay male spaces immediately then the years of silence of TIM destroy the lesbian ones. Its pretty clear who has the power hear and what the TIF behavior is based of.

[–] shewolfoffrance 6 points (+6|-0)

Yeah, the billionaires pushing gender ideology are all men. It's also worth pointing out the female detransitioners are some of the most committed activists for safeguarding women and children. Kiera Bell's lawsuit was a victory.

[–] Flower_tsuji 1 points (+2|-1) Edited

[adding to this post cuz i have more to say]

Trans men are in no shape or form the main cause of the mass destruction of woman spaces lol. While Ill agree we should talk about the effect as they are not blameless, I think if you look deeply into the trans cult…and they are a cult it should be clear that men are to blame. Blame the transmen/TIF is like blaming the little girls who were also rape victims that help recruit others into sex trafficking by Jeffree Epstein or the recruitrs in the NXIVM cult which also had sex trafficking. . which was also led by surprise, surprise a man. You aren’t looking at where most of the money , coercive control and psychological manipulation is coming from. Woman are just more susceptible to psychological manipulation, or maybe men are just better at being manipulative …regardless females make up the predominate number of victims in such situation. All of the ideology they have doesn’t benefit them at all, and if you follow who is actual at the chain of command its pretty clear where they got their thoughts from. Woman and children were targeted by AGP and trans ’woman’ because it helped validate their clearly fetish if you see that “its not just men” who are trans but it’s a big issue with ~everyone~.I think Abigail Shier book even mentions how some trans-men, who though they truly “weren’t female” anymore were suffering from problems in their stomach…which happened to be a still born baby because they thought they couldn’t be pregnant anymore. Or a “transwoman” Cherno Biko that raped a transman to make “nonbinary babies”. Time and time again I see innocents that show the transwoman know they are a man by their actions while the it’s the woman that fully believe the delusion. Also look at the real people that are orchestrating this madness, then men that slipped Gender into laws by stealth and the medical community backed by trans billionaires like martine rothblatt . [I kind of want to name a few examples first

I think its pretty clear the men are the orchestras of the manipulation if you look at the langue being used and trans dogma works like an abusive relationship. Now typical abusive relationships happen in private, for example a boyfriend or husband is beating the shit out of their spouse it happens behind close doors but the effect of that trauma does lead to public life. As the abused woman doesn’t cease being a human being with no impact on the physical and mental on her body. I’m sure people have seen or heard of woman who have been abused make the statements “well he hits me but he doesn’t mean it, he had a difficult day, but he still loves me”. The same woman will also sometimes be unable to detect abusive tendencies in others or they have to defend it…because if they don’t they would have to accept that the same thing is happening to them and they cannot mental accept this truth. They also repeat the exact excuse that their abusive male partner tell them. Now here is my example of seeing the abusive relationship on a wider scale, since unlike the abuse that starts in private then goes to public….trans ideology started in public on social media[from what I saw] and stayed in public. The way that woman and men push this dogma reveals that the men are far more aware then their counterparts who lack self-awareness. Take this conversation of Posie Parker Vs BLM protest [link to video below]. Posie was just screaming the truth woman are adult human females and transwoman are men etc, as she does. This angered the BLM as a whole but the young woman talk with Posie defending that trans woman are woman and are quiet verbal aggressive but don’t try to get physical at all. Then men however are aggressive and violent, because they know they can be and rush Poise and the group she with to steal their posters and ripe it up. Another example is when radical feminist protest human trafficking on international woman’s day. The transwomam showed how male he is by using sexist slurs and even tried to snatch another woman’s phone. He can’t answer any of the woman’s question at all…like they very basic “what is a woman” so he resorts to slurs and violence. The trans cultish even ask security to come over towards the woman. The”pro trans” woman was also verbal aggressive and are saying things like “trans woman are woman because they identity as woman./It’s the gender identity blah blah. The woman are trying to shame you emotional because they have been shamed emotional themselves but they never get physical at all.** These men act like this in public, how do you think they act in private to get the pro-trans activist woman to agree with them ?.

I see these examples everywhere conversation between a logical person and a tran cultish interact . The different in language that man and woman in the trans cult reveals fully who has the power and who does not. Woman parrot of the lies that ‘trans woman are woman/its their gender identity/suicided statists. They are all lies and incorrect facts but at the very least they try to offer some form or reasoning to their point. The fact that the trans ID males are self-aware enough to stop trying to use any “facts and logic” but to resort to violence when faced with someone they can’t manipulate shows acute critical thinking skills and intellectual self-awareness on the males that the transmen/trans id females do not have. Just like in a abusive man, if they cannot emotional and psychological entrap you the men use violence. Just like victims of abusive relationships they just repeat the same language from their abusive without being able to critical think or diverge a different thought pattern at all.

A lot of the grooming I saw specifical happened on tumblr. If anyone has watched the documentary Terf Wars on youtube you know what I’m talking about, Abigail Shier has mentioned this effect on social media in interviews based on her research for her book ‘Irreversible damage” as well. Trans youtubers also played a big part in this. I see a lot of people undermine the huge effect on social media and the influencers even though they have followers in the hundred thousand or millions and they have no problem sending their army of children to mass report or doxx people. Trans activist infiltrated online spaces about feminism, African American history, and LGB. Don’t you think it’s strange that most of these organization all have trans division now even though normal they don’t even get along ? BLm became Trans-blm, libfem who talked about misogyny became ‘transmisogyny, LGB became LGBTQT+. Its also where all the weird sexuality and fantasy genders like “cloud gender/tree gender” etc . A lof of this came from tumblr. Some of the trans ideology that I saw was on blogs that started of as pro-choice blogs that shared seemly accurate and informative post debunking lies about abortion, dangers of pregnancy….but they the added “trans woman” . A medical blog that mainly caters too young woman and girls who trust them…adding lies 😊…and anyone who question it is ‘applying gender binary to trans folk…or is a bigot I guess”. Children are not that smart…why would they question it ? Especial after these blogs had already established trust with their followers and agreed with them on issue young people where already interested in.

Tumblr was also full or predators as well and the trans ideology suits them well. Ive seen a tone of stories where a transmen is dating a transwoman and since the trans man who is female is “a male now” they have male privilege so they could never be raped transwoman who is a real male. It’s a manipulation of feminist theories perverted by queer theories so young woman can’t even think about saying no. If you look at ‘cotton ceiling rhetoric’ or how the trans cult threatens lesbian who are often ‘transmen’ some of the beginnings of the gaslighting is quite clear. As if you desist you again publicly ‘online’ get called transphobic and sent a lot of death threats…. After publicly being in abusive relationship [ just like a private one] they go out and say the same thing to another woman , minus the rape threats [strange how most woman still don’t try to send rape threats even when gaslight ? almost like there is something different about male and female aggression] It’s the trans id males/transwoman that told the trans woman any mention of their biology was hurtful and then threatened them with violence or & rape if they disagreed. So again you have woman…regardless of if think they are transmen/non-binary- or whatever still repeating the rhetoric of their abusers…and if you search where that logic came from in the first place turns out it’s an abusive male all along ! --* Radfem vs the trans cult https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERzBuDAH1fg posie parker vs BLM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5bFjw5LnNew I don’t have any “recites” for the tumblr abuse… But I think if you look up the cotton ceiling, or just say lesbians don’t like dick you will get a lot of evidence.

[–] A_Matriarch 7 points (+7|-0)

Can someone remind me what HSTS means again? 🤔

[–] Astraea1284 5 points (+5|-0)

It stands for homosexual transsexual.

[–] haruspex 1 points (+1|-0)

oh so a straight person? skkskskskskkss

[–] Astraea1284 2 points (+2|-0)

No, a gay man who adopts a stereotypically female name and feminine presentation to cope with dysphoria. They're more likely to undergo full genital surgery, I believe.

[–] GCRadFem 5 points (+5|-0)

People, as a rule, listen to male voices. Males hold the power in society. I believe as another woman commented here, that TIFS in general (always exceptions to everything) found a way to escape the misogyny of womanhood and grabbed it.

They went along for the ride on the trans train. Males, no matter what they call themselves, are powering that train.

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