The problem is that once you admit that "fake trans" exist and let people start asking questions about transitioners' motivations, the whole thing falls apart and it becomes obvious that there's actually no legitimate reason to transition.

Right now they just go by this undefinable "feeling of being a woman" (or man), and say that "cis people don't notice these feelings because their gender identity matches their sex". It's a convenient argument because it leaves "cis" people unable to question them, so to hold that up, they need to accept literally any man who says that he "feels like a woman". (except for detrans people, which is why they put so much effort into trying to silence them)

Those AGPs are the reason why tru trans got legal and political advancements. It was sexually abusive perverts who made trans a brand that got sold on social media and to the greater public.

Tru trans might be slightly saner than AGPs (highly debatable as far as I am concerned), but ultimately they are equally nonsensical and their ideology is based on the same "womanhood is a state of mind" mantra. Their position can be shredded to pieces just as easily as AGPs' s, so they need AGPs' s aggressiveness and their economical/social backing. AGPs are vindictive assholes, I don' t think it' s too farfetched that they might concoct a way to get their privileges while at the same time excluding their enemies, even when they are part of the same community.

So basically, going full force against them means that if tru trans are successfull, they get pushed back together with AGPs by society and the government, and if they fail, AGPs get their privileges and tru trans still get pushed away.

Why don’t decent men police and fix other men? Why don’t the good husbands, fathers, brothers and sons, ensure that other men aren’t raping, murdering and terrorising their mothers, sisters, wives and daughters?

It’s the same answer imho. Women and girls don’t matter enough to them. Even the decent men out there will believe they’ve done their bit by not treating us poorly, they won’t believe they have any responsibility for how other men treat us. At least not 99% of them. We can see the odd ‘true trans’ loudly speak up about the risk apg pose- Yardly did this, to the extent he had death threats, doxxed, dragged through court for ‘transphobia’. He was honest that TRAs were predator cultists grooming young lesbians, very vocally through the early years of this. One of Maya’s solicitors was a TiM who backed women all the way. There are a few rare men who can reflect on the power and privilege they have because of being male, and will use it to police other men’s behaviour towards women, even at cost to themselves. But these are the very very rare exceptions. 99.9% of men will not put themselves out for women (and I’m sure those who do have other flaws also).

30 years ago the HSTS pretty much left women alone. They were gay men who primarily got boob jobs and dressed like drag queens. You'd encounter them in clubs and in very large cities but that's it. In fact, when the first bathroom bill thing happened in S. Carolina my first thought was, "is there even a single transvestite in the entire state?!?!?" I thought it was the GOP making a mountain over a single very mentally ill young girl.

The AGPs were monitored better by society.

Was I naive!

However, those HSTS weren't exactly allies to women. I remember them being jerks to women in clubs and grabbing us to try to see what real boobs felt like.

I just don't believe in the true trans vs. fakers...it's all some version of men trying to invade womanhood.

If I’m wandering around in a cat costume pretending I’m a cat, the absolute last thing I should do is point out other people’s cat costumes and tell them they aren’t real cats. That’s the situation trans people are in - there’s no such thing as “true trans” because no human can or ever will change sex. Their only two options are to keep saying “no debate! No questions!” or admit that they’re all pretending and give up the whole charade.

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TRUE TRANS

"why aren't moderate incels working to disavow extreme incels"

because they are just various degrees of same hate movement, for example eli elrick is a violent serial rapist who confessed to ir and is still applauded and is doing some University of California Santa Cruz phd program while still interconnected with activism right now (btw TRAs bullied the victim into suicide allegedy), the tooth gap guy who i can't remember the name of has felony drug trafficking charges and is still trying to distribute drugs to kids.

They glofify the work of nazi genital transplant surgeons (which also catastrophically failed) who then went on to torture masses of jews to death in ww2. The founder of the gender identity sociology theory is someone who no consensually experimented on a male infant practiced on him infant cosmetic genital surgery and forced him to simulate sex acts on his also underage brother to make him a 'bottom'. Produced child porn of them under the gauze of 'genital inspections' and they both killed themselves compounded by these actions. You can watch the interview here where the victim asked whether he had to commit suicide for the experiments to be regarded as unsuccessful

it's not a bug its a feature even famous ones try to get child rapist + murderers leniency because they're the same religion.

Listen, I know most of us don’t believe in true trans and I’m not sure I do either, but how many TERFs started out fine with the idea of HSTS and then peaked because of depraved AGPs?

You're presuming an either/or categorization that I don't think exists. The fact is, AGPs can be and are just as much "true trans" as HSTSs. And plenty of HSTSs have AGP too. In fact, I believe that the vast majority of gay TIMs especially today have AGP.

As I see it, AGP is a sexualized expression of male narcissism driven by the male libido and male sexual fantasies inspired by pornography that can be found among self-absorbed, vain, preening, porn-consuming boys and men who are attracted to, enthralled by and/or aroused by the external trappings of "femininity" - regardless of their sexual orientation.

Those who believe in "true trans" say that to be legitimately "trans" requires having "gender dysphoria." But AGPs have just as much "gender dysphoria" as HSTS males who don't have AGP and TIFs do. In fact, sexologists like Blanchard and Bailey say, and some women acknowledge, that the erotically-driven "gender dysphoria" of men and adolescent boys with AGP is often the most painful, overwhelming, persistent and hard to bear and treat kind of "gender dysphoria" of all.

Because nearly all the male "trans" (certainly all the het men) are AGP to a greater (usually) or lesser degree. And even many of the "trutrans" are themselves AGP.

The truth is that the AGPs outnumber the HSTSs by a significant margin. HSTSs are a minority within a minority, being a subgroup of gay men. AGPs, being a subgroup of straight men, is mathematically gonna be a much larger population.

And the second truth is that the majority of AGPs know the truth about themselves: they are more like the vocally extreme Yanivs and Long Chus than they ever want to admit to other people. Long Chu is just saying the quiet part out loud. Yaniv is just doing in the open what the rest of the AGPs wish they could do: exert control and dominate women overtly, to satisfy a sexual desire.

When people like this get called out, or feel like people are getting close to the truth, they get defensive. This can cloud their judgment and cause them to dig in and defend things that aren't actually in their best interest. They reveal a truth about themselves when they defend things.

Because they already get whatever they want anyway. They have access to the changing rooms, the sports, the prisons. Why should they bother about the men who terrorize women? They were already indifferent to the women who were uncomfortable with their presence in our spaces to begin with. From their perspective, there is nothing to gain by doing the right thing.