[–] Tesserae_Tali HERetic 40 points (+41|-1) Edited

These are not boys with a strange sexual fetish. These are not porn addicts.

Unfortunately, I'm sure that many of them--possibly even most of them--are. Of course teenage boys don't share their sexual fantasies with their mothers, and of course mothers don't want to go looking for evidence that their sons are paraphiliacs. But speaking from my time in the trenches of r/itsafetish, there is no shortage of trans-identified teenage autogynephiles, and I'd bet good money that some of them are the sons of the women in this support group.

[–] littleowl12 17 points (+17|-0)

Parents also have trouble facing reality when their kid has been sexually abused, too. And that's what I believe is happening to these young boys that are talking to older TIMs online, and are sold a bill of goods in anime circles, too.

If you read the link I posted above, some of these boys honestly believe there's a possibility to look like an anime character in real life. That's how disoriented they are.

[–] XX_Power 3 points (+3|-0)

That was the first thing I thought when i read that. No chance these children haven't been heavily consuming hardcore porn for years. The mum even admits they're tech savvy.

I really liked the rest of the article but that part just made me think, maybe they are a little bit bad parents. I know i know, it's probably nearly impossible to shield your male kid from hardcore porn. Hell, i know a kindergartner who told me her kids have shown her absolutely vile porn on their tablets. Kindergartners!!

But just acting like not my thoughtful special Nigel son, he'd never watch "teenage sl@ts p@ssy being destroyed" honestly helps no one.

[–] suupersami 30 points (+30|-0)

100% of the boys in our group are socially awkward. 64% have anxiety, 52% have depression, 40% have ADHD, and around 50% have Autism or Autism-like behaviors (our survey total is 67). Amazingly, over 85% of these kids are gifted (IQ above 130). Sadly, 20% of them have recently experienced a significant trauma such as the death or chronic illness of a parent or sibling. But generally, these are nerdy, awkward boys on the edges of their social circles. Some of them have no friends at all.

This is so depressing. These boys are clearly being preyed upon by grown TIMs, and targeted specifically for their social isolation.

[–] Turtlefuzz [OP] Flairy Godmother 14 points (+14|-0)

Being a child means they are already vulnerable, but these pedos and TIMs love to go for the most vulnerable ones. It's disgusting.

[–] littleowl12 22 points (+22|-0)

These are not boys with a strange sexual fetish. These are not porn addicts

Sadly, this is not true. https://quillette.com/2021/04/06/when-sons-become-daughters-part-ii-parents-of-transitioning-boys-speak-out-on-their-own-suffering/

Porn and anime are a big part if this. Adults are manipulating the sexual development of young boys through exposure to these things. There are many accounts of young AGPs who watched hours upon hours of sissy porn. Parents don't realize how early boys are exposed to porn, and how easy it is to access. Boys will almost never willingly admit it, or if they do, share the details. Of course teen boys can't bring themselves to do that.

We need to hold the porn industry accountable and hell, even the anime industry for the way they pursue kids. We did it with tobacco companies, we can do it with them.

I wonder if we'll finally see a public shift against porn when the first generation of men with lifelong porn exposure become fathers. It'll be interesting to see if a generation fully awake to what porn really is will tolerate its influence in the lives of their children.

[–] spacykate 19 points (+19|-0)

Used to be these guys would get into heavy metal or form a DnD group. Now they're "trans".

[–] littleowl12 14 points (+14|-0)

Yeah. Remember when parents were worried that D&D caused too much detachment from reality, and too much fantasy thinking?

At least D&D never inspired boys to go on hormones and get breast implants.

[–] SarahTheGreen 14 points (+14|-0)

So now we have three groups of TIMs? The effeminate homosexuals, the fetishists, and the nerds who feel isolated. Damn.

[–] Lilim 21 points (+21|-0)

I think there’s an overlap between the last two. Adult TIMs are usually pretty socially awkward and addicted to porn. With this cult going mainstream and being pushed in schools, the propaganda is reaching younger kids. Even if they aren’t watching porn, I bet they still have access to social media or are being influenced by peers who were also awkward nerds and are all of a sudden stunning and brave and deserve special privileges.

[–] NecessaryScene 5 points (+5|-0) Edited

Yeah, it seems to me many/most of these are still AGP, it's just that it now has a chance to exhibit itself earlier.

Previously societal conformance would tend to keep it "in the closet" until triggered later in life - generally by a combination of ever-increasing urges, financial security and a mid-life crisis (typically when partner expecting a child).

But now there's far less need to keep the AGP under wraps when young - society is encouraging people to come out.

This is akin to the explanation genderists posit for female ROGD, but I don't buy it there. For males, we are seeing increased numbers at all ages, and the increase isn't that ridiculously huge in adolescents - and some of that increase can plausibly be "early AGP", ie a cohort coming out earlier in life.

For females, the 4000% increase can't be "early" because there is no significant later-onset number of TIFs, either historically or now. This is clearly a cohort that would in previous times have gone on to have no long-term gender dysphoria.

Although nothing's totally black-and-white. A few of the adolescent males will be ROGD akin to females, arising from body issues. But my view is that ROGD is primarily female, like cutting or anorexia. Same basic characteristics - females have more body issues and are more prone to social contagion.

[–] XX_Power 1 points (+1|-0)

Very well written!

I remember when ana was REALLY big and it's true, there was the occasional rare male, often gays. These are the only ROGD males in my opinion and they're incredibly rare and also basically just a variant of the HSTS.

[–] VirginiaW 5 points (+5|-0)

There’s also kids with autism or on the spectrum. It’s really troubling. I liked this article.

[–] anonwasawoman 3 points (+3|-0)

I've thought for a while there was a third group, but the group I see are men trying desperately not to be the oppressor white male in modern woke communities. I knew a mom who started claiming her two sons were trans - one 3 and mostly nonverbal, the other 7 also mostly nonverbal with lifelong damage from being deprived of oxygen at his homebirth - and I know for a fact it was to avoid having her children be seen as the oppressors. I've seen it with Tims online, as well. Any of you from the old debate sub, masks seemed to highlight that category of men desperate to not be the problem.

[–] XX_Power 1 points (+1|-0)

The venn diagram of the AGPs and nerds is a circle.

She's well meaning but it seems to me that her love for her son clouds her judgement (which is understandable). Nowadays you'll be hard pressed to find a 14yo boy who doesn't watch porn, among normal healthy boys. You can't tell me that these boys with their zoo of mental illnesses and their internet addiction have not been groomed by porn. No chance, absolutely zero. I'd even wager that they've already watched more vile stuff than me, and I'm a woman in my 30s who used to watch porn.

[–] hypatia 12 points (+12|-0)

It is time to stop dismissing mothers. Because these women are the experts on their children.

And yes, no person can read the thoughts inside another person’s head, nor perfectly measure every emotion someone else feels, but moms are as close to that as it gets.

I think that this attitude that Mom knows everything and is right about whatever you're going through is actually part of whatever teenaged rebelliousness teens are expressing when they declare themselves trans after having no prior "symptoms".

Every teenager, around the age of 12-15, is going to go through that stage where they separate themselves from their mother's closeness, because they realize they are now becoming an adult and beginning to have desires and feelings that their mothers disapprove of.

This happens with literally every person on the planet.

[–] Turtlefuzz [OP] Flairy Godmother 11 points (+11|-0)

Yep, all the people saying "trans is the new emo" are on the right track, I think. Unfortunately this fad will leave a lot of carnage in its path.

[–] chrysthefeminist 11 points (+11|-0)

One of the biggest jokes I've ever heard from a woman: "My son is innocent!"

[–] hypatia 6 points (+6|-0)

LOL! That's hilarious.

I feel like mom's probably have some sort of selective, deliberate ignorance when it comes to their sons' sexuality. You would have to, to stay sane.

[–] mathlover 5 points (+5|-0) Edited

When girls complain about the boys who trans, virtually all the complaints are about behavior that is the same as adult autogynephilic heterosexual male trans. Ie: hypersexualized, creepy, predatory. And many of those adult men were (some still are) socially awkward, shy, nerdy, autistic, etc - you can be any or all of that and be a predatory AGP at any age.

Autogynephilia first presents at the onset of puberty - around 10 or so for boys now - though the porn that boys are now exposed to at increasingly younger ages may be pushing that age even younger. So a good proportion of the boys who trans at around those ages are likely young incipient autogynephiles. This is consistent with the behaviors girls complain about in the boys.

Parents absolutely do not know about their sons porn use. And these boys behave very differently when out of sight and supervision of parents and teachers. Unless there is a recogntion and admission that these boys are young AGP predators, no solution is going to be effective because it will not affect the root cause. The girls whose rights, dignity, and bodies are routinely being violated by "trans" boys know this. We should be listening to them.

[–] SawItComing 2 points (+2|-0) Edited

I think she's really onto something with 'misomatery'.

I mean, mothers have always been hated, mistrusted and blamed, especially when kids 'went wrong'. They used also to be worthy of respect, though - the public care shown to pregnant women, the respect of the 'matronly woman' with grown children, the respect for women's running of the domestic sphere within the family. Now that's all gone and all we have is hatred and disgust when it comes to mothers.