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My autocorrect doesn’t even offer the word matriarchy.

I’m still mad about that stupid “Cooking with Trans Women of Color,” mostly about the Colombian dish that stated families ate it under “matriarchal leadership.” In other words Mom telling everyone that dinner is ready.

Every culture in the world has mothers that tell you to sit down and eat your damn spaghetti. Don’t pee on my leg and tell me it’s raining.

This is a common pattern I see with woke people. They claim most other cultures are matriarchal. They claim their own are, or their families are.

I don’t care if Mom is head of the household. That’s not matriarchy. Note that it begins and ends with the family. The “leadership” evaporates when it comes to courts, government, means of production, and spirituality. They are few and far between, the higher up you go.

If Colombia were a matriarchy it wouldn’t have a high femicide rate. Or rape.

Stop humble-bragging that your single mom made all the decisions. She had to do all the work because men usually don’t think they have to pitch in. And her power diminishes every step she takes further from the house.

Patriarchy covers the planet. There are degrees of it but it’s everywhere. It’s atrocity denial to say that all other cultures are matriarchal Smurf villages. You are denying what women the world over go through. You are sugarcoating the overwhelming dominance of patriarchy.

My autocorrect doesn’t even offer the word matriarchy. I’m still mad about that stupid “Cooking with Trans Women of Color,” mostly about the Colombian dish that stated families ate it under “matriarchal leadership.” In other words Mom telling everyone that dinner is ready. Every culture in the world has mothers that tell you to sit down and eat your damn spaghetti. Don’t pee on my leg and tell me it’s raining. This is a common pattern I see with woke people. They claim most other cultures are matriarchal. They claim their own are, or their families are. I don’t care if Mom is head of the household. That’s not matriarchy. Note that it begins and ends with the family. The “leadership” evaporates when it comes to courts, government, means of production, and spirituality. They are few and far between, the higher up you go. If Colombia were a matriarchy it wouldn’t have a high femicide rate. Or rape. Stop humble-bragging that your single mom made all the decisions. She had to do all the work because men usually don’t think they have to pitch in. And her power diminishes every step she takes further from the house. Patriarchy covers the planet. There are degrees of it but it’s everywhere. It’s atrocity denial to say that all other cultures are matriarchal Smurf villages. You are denying what women the world over go through. You are sugarcoating the overwhelming dominance of patriarchy.

57 comments

[–] ramani 68 points (+69|-1)

You’re absolutely right. I’m an immigrant from a country where my tribal group actually did afford legal rights to women (inheritance of property, for example) when the rest of the country did not, and the women in my family were very strong-willed and resourceful. BUT ... that did not mean they had actual power, or even much agency in their lives. My great-great grandmother was married off right after her first period - she was just a young child!! The husband was a grown man. And another relative was raped and impregnated by one of her in-laws, and forced to both give birth to and give away the baby. I can go on and on. Tragic doesn’t even begin to describe it.

“Woke” people just make up histories of nations and cultures of which they really know nothing, even if they have ancestral connections to them. I’ve seen this in my own cultural group. It’s bizarre and ridiculous. But, like most indulged young people, they think they know everything. And they create some mythological “monster” - Colonialism, for example - before which they theorize everything was wonderful and equal between the different groups of people, and of course there were no binary sex categories and distinctions, etc., etc.

Sometimes I honestly wonder whether it’s because a lot of these people live too much online, and this has distorted their sense of what real life is, especially for women in poor countries in the global south. I’ve lived in both kinds of societies, and the sheer cluelessness of “woke” people is unbelievable.

[–] questioningtw 19 points (+19|-0)

One of my friends is from Mexico and is a busser, she is one of the few female bussers at her work and is highly intelligent and speaks her mind. She also talks about how Mexican men will often openly cheat on their wives and pretty much demand respect even if they are total jerks. I know a woman gardner too that works with her husband and while she mows and does all the stuff the men do, she is also talked down to by the men.

[–] KBash 9 points (+9|-0)

Oh yes, when I lived in Mexico for years men with rings on their fingers would hit on me...when I called them out they’d laugh and talk about their pregnant wife or gf, and then go back to trying to make me sleep with them.

This was common, and a lot of people acted as if it were just inevitable 🤷🏼‍♀️

[–] A_Matriarch 7 points (+7|-0) Edited

I woulda told them to their faces that I hoped their wives were cheating on them with their bosses and friends. 🚶🏽‍♀️🚶🏽‍♀️🚶🏽‍♀️

[–] LadyGlum 18 points (+18|-0)

It is because they live too much online. They're also always very ignorant and not willing to go look outside twitter or tumblr for answers. They can often be kind people but all the TRAs of my acquaintance have dysfunctional friendships, dysfunctional families and turn online. Crucially the part that seems to turn them into TRAs is a lack of curiosity. They're not stupid, but they won't seek out information and decide for themselves. They want to be presented with a set of beliefs they can follow uncritically, though they might pretend otherwise. They really don't like to be asked questions about it because they can't actually answer them. When I see the irate IRAs (not the actual trans) arguing online I often think about my friends and imagine them sitting typing the comments. They want to be nice. They want community. They want to release some of their bitterness and tension. They want to think of themselves as good people. And they're not. They'll spout lies to protect those they are told are the most vulnerable but when actually vulnerable people come along and ask for their help they don't know what to do because real life doesn't happen in slogans and it comes with difficult decisions. Ultimately they just want to do as little as possible to improve the world but also don't want to deal with the guilt of sitting there. So slinging woke-approved statements on twitter is just perfect for them. One of their 123 followers (mostly porn bots) might see that they said black lives matter! They can make a difference!

[–] Owlchaser 5 points (+5|-0)

Really well worded comment :\ I don't get why people can't accept that they aren't perfect. It's difficult at first, to take a blow to your ego, but it makes you feel better about life in the long term.

They want to be presented with a set of beliefs they can follow uncritically

With religion losing popularity at an amazing rate in the west, this isn't surprising. These are the exact same people who would've blindly followed whatever faith they were born into 70 years ago, and relished in looking down on anyone outside the norm.

[–] Neelakesi 17 points (+17|-0)

Asking because of your username, are you Indian / Malayali? 'Malayalis were a matriarchy' is something I have often heard, yet men from the state are some of the most patriarchal that I have met. I have never been able to make sense of it.

[–] ramani 17 points (+17|-0)

I’m South Asian, but beyond that I’m scared to say exactly what part, because of all the doxxing and harassing TRAs are capable of. I live in a super-woke state where TRAs are particularly active too.😕

[–] [Deleted] 3 points (+3|-0)

i hate these statements lol. the entirety of india is patriarchal, even the tribal communities, at this point. everything else is cringe virtue-signalling

[–] littleowl12 [OP] 16 points (+18|-2)

It's such a great way for men to absolve themselves of any responsibility to try to do better. They'll take this one sliver of benefit of colonization- they can blame someone else for their own misogyny. "I'd be so much better if I weren't kept down by white men." You'd be richer and happier for sure, but why can't you treat the women in your life decently right fucking now? If you really value your quest for liberation, don't you have empathy for your mother, daughters, sisters, and lovers who want liberation, too?

[–] ramani 11 points (+13|-2)

This whole “colonialism” thing is just bewildering to me, because in my culture the British Empire came to an end even before my mother was born (and I’m a middle-aged woman, so it was loooong ago)! How a long ago empire still apparently dictates life in South Asia makes absolutely no sense to me on a personal level, and even less sense if you actually study colonial-era history, as I did in college. Hell, I can give quite a few examples of how my family (and quite a few others) benefitted from colonial rule, but you can’t say anything about that because it goes against what the Wokearati deem to be Correct. It’s totally inaccurate, ahistorical and intellectually bankrupt.

NOT to defend colonialism in any way, but countries conquering other countries is a tragic fact of human history from the very beginning of the historical record. We have to move on, somehow, instead of constantly complaining about how every single issue in our lives is due to “colonialism”.

[–] pennygadget 11 points (+12|-1)

"Woke” people just make up histories of nations and cultures of which they really know nothing, even if they have ancestral connections to them.

Its so racist and infantilizing. Woke westerners act as if all POC foreigners danced naked in the fields all day and lived in an egalitarian, gender neutral utopia before The White Man arrived and taught them about gender and misogyny. It also strips POC men of responsibility for the terrible things they do to their own women

[–] tamata 51 points (+52|-1)

That's ridiculously stupid, I did not realize that some people had this stance.

I'm from the Middle East, which is absolutely smothered by atrocious misogyny due to Islamic beliefs and practices. Women are, by and large, the head of the households. They are the ones making sure the house and children's affairs are all in order. They make a lot of the important household decisions while the father is away or passive. Also, one of the most interesting observations I've made growing up is that the children usually follow the mother's Islam and not the father's. Islam is extremely arbitrary and people practice it with an extraordinary amount of variation. The father being gone most of the time means that if the mother is okay with television and music, or social media, or eating Ramen noodles and Mcdonalds, the children will be, too, regardless of what the father thinks, and his family overpowers him as the children get older.

Does this mean that the mother is respected in her society and even her own household? No. Does this mean that the mother is protected by the law in case her husband wants to divorce her and take the children? No.

Does this mean JACK SHIT other than the fact that the father isn't interested in doing chores and raising his children? No, I do not believe that it does.

[–] proudcatlady 21 points (+22|-1)

Exactly. In evangelical Christianity husbands are supposed to be “head of household” (nvm that’s not what the Bible actually says; it’s good for male ego so it must be true). However, most men disengage from their families regardless of religion, so the women are the de facto leaders. Doesn’t mean they get treated with any respect or that they matter outside of that sphere. And if hubby wants to pack up and head somewhere else, they go regardless of how she feels or what she wants.

[–] Tnetennba 19 points (+19|-0) Edited

It's absolutely bonkers how conservative Christian culture has no biblical basis for 99% of its rules.

Almost like it's an excuse for men to be sexually and culturally dominant...

[–] proudcatlady 3 points (+3|-0)

Someone else in this thread had a good list of pretty unambiguously sexist Bible verses. The ones in I Timothy were particularly bad. Some of the others have been debunked as mistranslations but I have a lot more reading to don

[–] Amareldys 6 points (+6|-0)

Um the Bible is not innocent on this subject...

Ephesians 5:22-24 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands.

1 Corinthians 11:3 But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a wife is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.

1 Timothy 2:11-15 Let a woman learn quietly with all submissiveness. I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet. For Adam was formed first, then Eve; and Adam was not deceived, but the woman was deceived and became a transgressor. Yet she will be saved through childbearing—if they continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control.

Genesis 2:18 Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.”

1 Timothy 2:12 ESV / 51 helpful votes I do not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man; rather, she is to remain quiet.

Colossians 3:18 ESV / 44 helpful votes Wives, submit to your husbands, as is fitting in the Lord.

1 Peter 3:1 ESV / 37 helpful votes Likewise, wives, be subject to your own husbands, so that even if some do not obey the word, they may be won without a word by the conduct of their wives,

Titus 2:5 ESV / 30 helpful votes To be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled.

[–] proudcatlady 3 points (+3|-0)

Thanks for the summary! I’ll have to look into those. Currently I’m more into Jesus and throwing Paul out because he clearly had personal problems with women.

[–] bellatrixbells 9 points (+9|-0)

Ha ! I love your interventions, are you still intending to make further posts on the subject ? I read them eagerly !

[–] Stealthygal 7 points (+7|-0)

Yeah, I've noticed that the stereotype of Middle Eastern men is that the only person they will absolutely bow down to is their mum. Which ultimately seems to mean that a woman's best route to power is birthing sons, who, once adult, will take care of her and do as she tells them - at least, when she's around. It's not very reliable.

[–] ComplicatedSpirit 44 points (+44|-0)

Woman: Cooks something

Libfems: “Wow, this must be a matriarchal society! I cant possibly fathom how any society would let a woman near a cooking fire if it wasn’t because she was in charge of everything. You’re so blessed!”

Woman: “I’m cooking this for my 13-year-old daughter’s wedding. My husband just made an arrangement for her to marry out 26-year-old neighbor.”

Libfem: “....... And the fact that you’re co-celebrating this happy event by cooking a meal for all the guests shows that you had just as much, if not more, agency in this decision! I’m so happy for you and your daughter!”

[–] Alecto 35 points (+37|-2)

Here's the thing--if they can say matriarchy exists in places that aren't colonized by white people, then they can deduce misogyny is just a side effect of white supremacy, if it even exists at all. That means they focus on every other issue under the sun that affects men, but not the one that only affects women, because once they overthrow white supremacy, all of our problems will be solved. It isn't men who are the problem around the globe--it's white people.

[–] BlackCirce 40 points (+42|-2)

⬆️ why i don't bother with black nationalism and allying with black men on the issue of race. ill take my chances with women tyvm ⬆️ there are black men who say these exact sentences over and over ⬆️ like bruh what is stopping you from treating women like human beings today ? what does colonialism have to do with you? ⬆️ #stopcallingwomenhoeschallenge

[–] Alecto 22 points (+22|-0)

I rather liked your idea of female nationalism. Men will take any excuse to avoid confronting their own supremacy. It's why so much of male 'feminism' is somehow all about ensuring male sexual access to women.

[–] BeninBronze 18 points (+19|-1)

Yes, this is why so of my black sisters are divesting from black men. They want racial unity to fight white supremacy but that’s not possible when they keep treating women like sex objects in both black media and real life. But no, stating this fact is regarded as decisive 🙄

[–] proudcatlady 26 points (+28|-2)

This is so spot-on but you can’t say it or else you’re a racist. This also explains why “intersectional feminism” is either about white TIM or black men (many of whom treat black women like garbage, but they’re women, so who cares). I don’t get why feminism is the only movement that has to center everyone BUT women—oh wait, yes I do. It’s because it’s a women’s movement and women need to SHUT UP.

[–] Alecto 23 points (+23|-0)

It infuriates me to see women accused of bigotry for calling out sexism in minority communities, even if they're a member of those communities themselves. They're shamed into staying silent because you want to present a united front against the oppressor, don't you? You don't want to give outsiders fuel for their racism/xenophobia, do you? It's very abusive to the women in those communities.

[–] IronicWolf 15 points (+15|-0)

I’ve also seen it argued that people from traditionally oppressed groups don’t have to bother with any other social justice, environmental or other ethical issues. Somehow that (nonsense) argument never applies to women though.

[–] BluecatSarah 5 points (+5|-0)

I guess it’s because patriarchy is a system that extracts resources from women for the benefit of men. Even by calling it feminism.

[–] Owlchaser 6 points (+6|-0)

Lol. If white people were wiped out tomorrow, the goalposts would move the very next day.

[–] littleowl12 [OP] 21 points (+22|-1)

And no offense to anyone, but often what a Woke person is describing as unique and magical is actually standard worldwide. Spicy food? Everyone in the Southern hemisphere has that blessing. Women spinning fiber and weaving? From the tail end of South America to the Arctic circle. Religious ceremonies? Show me a culture that does NOT have that. Don't get me wrong, these are all lovely things. And we should study them to see how much we have in common, and how to overcome differences. But none of it is magical. It's all very common, with patriarchy being most common of all. It's not dependent on local natural resources. Men everywhere love it.

And even in a truly egalitarian society, that's not matriarchal by definition. It's egalitarian. If that's how you believe the world should be, that's fine, but then, use the word egalitarian.

Stop confusing women's work (textiles, cooking, home keeping, clerical work, midwifery, etc) with liberation. Work is not liberation- it's just work.

[–] questioningtw 20 points (+20|-0)

Uh. I am taking a Spanish class, and the teacher talks a lot about cultures in Mexico and S. America. They have some of the most chauvanistic and machismo cultures in the world. She even played a song once where women were singing a story about a man who murdered his girlfriend in public for dancing with antother man. It turned out that she was only dancing with her brother, but she totally forgives him before she died. And apparently you are supposed to feel sorry for him because he was in jail for murdering "his love"

[+] [Deleted] 8 points (+8|-0)
[–] KBash 5 points (+6|-1) Edited

Interestingly, the chauvinism and machismo come from the Spanish, and for them it comes from the Moorish (even pre-Islam, many North African and Middle Eastern tribes were notoriously patriarchal...they just overlaid their patriarchy onto Islam and justified it through cherry-picked Islamic law after Islam was introduced). The Moors conquered Spain and controlled the Iberian peninsula for a while (I know they were actually surprisingly secular and fairly egalitarian and enlightened in their approach to rule- but not toward women, of course; they were just happy to allow Jews and Gentiles to practice their own forms of Abrahamic religion as well).

They were/are notoriously patriarchal, and that’s where Spanish, Mediterranean and Latin American machismo come from.

[–] A_Matriarch 17 points (+17|-0) Edited

As a black woman, it burns me up to hear black people say this goofy shit about the black community. They need to tell me HOW black women - who were also slaves and- under double domination of both white men and black men somehow up and erected themselves a whole matriarchal order where rule of law, economics, property, and marriage is decided by women. They think a bunch of poor single mothers being propped up on white men’s meager food stamps after their baby daddys abandon them is a MATRIARCHY!!! It makes me DIZZY as fuck!
The women are the ones holding down the fort because they have no choice! NOT because BW have come together - like they should - and decide that the entirety of cultural and social dynamics will revolve around woman leaders and woman centered priorities. It’s the exact opposite in the black community and they know it!!! The community is the most male identified, male coddling, fuck shit imaginable. They accuse it of being matriarchy purely to blame black women for the shambles the community is in, never to actually honor or dignify female leadership.

YES! I've seen so many people point to the black community to say "see? Matriarchy doesn't work." No, the black community has patriarchy like everybody else! And any problems in the community are not because of feminism of any sort. Conservatives have this strange notion that feminism has "destroyed the black family."

Where? At what point? "When they said men were unnecessary!!!" No, feminism has never been about that. We HAVE said that you're better off with no man than with a toxic man, so don't keep sacrificing yourself for a toxic man. If men don't like it, they can stop being toxic and abusive. And honestly, conservatives, do you disagree? Do you think a woman is better off with a toxic abuser than as a single woman?

The black community is not feminist, and not matriarchal. They look just like the rest of the world in that respect.

[–] A_Matriarch 4 points (+4|-0)

Exactly, in my black woman centered groups we call our community “blackistan” for a REASON! Ain’t no matriarchy here....

[–] Jellyfishes 16 points (+16|-0)

And being the head of household is not that much of a privilege for women, since it means having to take care of all the cleaning, child rearing and housechores. All of it for free.

[–] overandout 16 points (+16|-0)

People confusing the family being female dominated with the whole society. Some western cultures ARE the odd ones out with fathers being so central to daily family life in terms of decision making but that doesn't make the overall society matriarchal.

[–] IronicWolf 14 points (+14|-0)

Men abandoning their responsibilities and families does not a matriarchy make. In fact, it’s patriarchy: men get to do what they like, create children they later abandon, make promises to women that they break and then leave women to pick up the pieces and raise the children.

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