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UK feminist Maya Forstater has just won a major victory in defending the ability to express gender critical ideas in the workplace. Naturally, all of us at Ovarit, and radical and gender critical feminists everywhere are cock-a-hoop!

Please confine the discussion to this thread and post all new articles here so that the rest of /o/GenderCritical doesn't get swamped in material relating to this case, and so that we have all it all in one place for future reference.

I'll collate important links here and update as they come in. Add anything good you find to the comments and I'll pop it up here when I get the time.

OVARIT REACTS

FEMINIST RESPONSES

LEGAL RESPONSES

MAINSTREAM MEDIA

LGBT++ PRESS

UK feminist Maya Forstater has just won a major victory in defending the ability to express gender critical ideas in the workplace. Naturally, all of us at Ovarit, and radical and gender critical feminists everywhere are cock-a-hoop! Please confine the discussion to this thread and post all new articles here so that the rest of /o/GenderCritical doesn't get swamped in material relating to this case, and so that we have all it all in one place for future reference. I'll collate important links here and update as they come in. Add anything good you find to the comments and I'll pop it up here when I get the time. **OVARIT REACTS** - "[Gender critical beliefs ARE worthy of respect in a democratic society" - Maya Forstater case](https://www.ovarit.com/o/GenderCritical/33616/gender-critical-beliefs-are-worthy-of-respect-in-a-democratic-society-maya-forst) from /u/endthewoo - [Maya Forstater won! (twitter.com)](https://www.ovarit.com/o/GenderCritical/33614/maya-forstater-won) **FEMINIST RESPONSES** - [The Critic: Jo Bartosch - A victory for free speech and sex-based rights](https://thecritic.co.uk/a-victory-for-free-speech-and-sex-based-rights/) - [The Telegraph: Suzanne Moore - Maya Forstater's victory injects some good sense into the toxic trans debate](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/10/maya-forstaters-victory-injects-good-sense-toxic-trans-debate/) [[Archive](https://archive.fo/hreER)] - [WOLF: “The Tribunal Failed to Remain Neutral": Lessons from the UK on freedom of belief](https://www.womensliberationfront.org/news/the-tribunal-failed-to-remain-neutral-lessons-from-the-uk-on-freedom-of-belief) - [Sex Matters: We are worthy of respect in a democratic society](https://sex-matters.org/posts/updates/gender-critical-beliefs-are-worthy-of-respect-in-a-democratic-society/) - [Unherd: Video interview with Maya Forstater (28 mins)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=jEqr5cIqYsg&feature=youtu.be&fbclid=IwAR1NqiHak7_TzwSzNKsI2Dbv9zsqMGcH-oED8Dbk9cy-38Parsj-bxD8JwA) - [Merched Cymru: The Forstater Judgment: Implications for Wales](https://merchedcymru.wales/2021/06/11/the-forstater-judgment-implications-for-wales/) - [Morning Star: Ruth Serwotka - A light has been shone on women’s rights for all the world to see](https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/f/light-has-been-shone-one-womens-rights-all-world-see) **LEGAL RESPONSES** - [The Forstater Judgment: What Next? (by Maya's lawyer)](https://www.ovarit.com/o/GenderCritical/33619/the-forstater-judgment-what-next-by-maya-s-lawyer) - [Lesbian and Gay News: Maya victorious: Court rules gender critical beliefs are a protected characteristic, writes LGN legal commentator Dennis Kavanagh](https://lesbianandgaynews.com/2021/06/maya-victorious-court-rules-gender-critical-beliefs-are-a-protected-characteristic-writes-lgn-legal-commentator-dennis-kavanagh/) - [Forstater v CGD Europe & others](https://oldsquare.co.uk/forstater-v-cgd-europe-others/) - first posted by /u/ChristinaXYZ **MAINSTREAM MEDIA** - [The Times: Woman who lost job over transgender tweets wins appeal](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/woman-who-lost-job-over-transgender-tweets-wins-appeal-0l5qjmxvq) - [The Guardian: Gender-critical views are a protected belief, appeal tribunal rules](https://www.theguardian.com/law/2021/jun/10/gender-critical-views-protected-belief-appeal-tribunal-rules-maya-forstater) - [BBC: Maya Forstater: Woman wins tribunal appeal over transgender tweets](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-57426579) - [Yahoo: Woman who lost her job — but gained J.K. Rowling's support — over trans tweets wins appeal](https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/woman-who-lost-her-job-but-gained-jk-rowlings-support-over-trans-tweets-wins-appeal-180435503.html) - [The Times: The Times view on the Maya Forstater verdict: Right to Think](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-times-view-on-the-maya-forstater-verdict-right-to-think-qgvbgb0dc) - Daily Mail: [Interview with Maya. 'I was just fighting for everyone's right to hold an opinion': Mother who lost her job for saying trans women can never be truly female speaks out after landmark court victory backed by JK Rowling ](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9680247/Mother-lost-job-saying-trans-women-never-truly-female-speaks-out.html) [[Archive link](https://archive.fo/E89Px)] - [LBC: Maya Forstater: Why I'm standing up for people with gender critical beliefs](https://www.lbc.co.uk/news/maya-forstater-woman-lost-job-over-gender-tweets-says-word-woman-excludes-males/) - [SKY (Video) Woman sacked over gender-critical views wins court appeal](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpmIl4zrIX0) **LGBT++ PRESS** - [British court rules in favour of researcher in transgender tweet row](https://www.openlynews.com/i/?id=ff4d471e-190a-4e0a-ab79-ded6cbe24fb7) - DIVA: Jane Fae - [A minor but inconsequential victory: Director of TransActual and Chair of Trans Media Watch reflects on the Maya Forstater case](https://divamag.co.uk/2021/06/11/a-minor-but-inconsequential-victory-director-of-transactual-and-chair-of-trans-media-watch-reflects-on-the-maya-forstater-case/amp/?__twitter_impression=true) (this one is quite unhinged)

69 comments

[–] NotCis 68 points (+68|-0)

Thanks for making this post! I'm so glad about this and I feel so much solidarity with all of you. It feels like a victory for not only gender-critical thought, but free thought everywhere.

[–] XX_Power 37 points (+37|-0)

I have so much respect for British women! 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧 I hope our politicians see this

[–] ChristinaXYZ 49 points (+49|-0)

Two really important useful points if you're in the UK and are arguing with either your children's school or your local police force make this a useful document to save, print and send by email or take with you as support.

"Education authorities will want to review their policies to determine whether a cohort of pupils and students are being miseducated by the presentation of a contentious and doctrinaire view of sex and gender as being a matter of settled fact. "

"National police forces – some of whom have been taking the names of people who express Gender Critical thought and “checking their thinking” for signs of potential “hate crime” will now wish to consider whether any of this data is lawfully held and what their statistics actually and meaningfully represent."

Will affect Katie Alcock the Girl Guides problem I wonder?

[–] womenopausal [OP] witch babe 35 points (+35|-0) Edited

Excellent points! The ramifications of this are bigger than women being able to express themselves in the workplace starting from this glorious day. There are a lot of women in Maya's position who've lost out on work etc that didn't have her resources or determination and maybe they have claims to make (I know women like this, not sure if they would want to take action, but it's a possibility).

What about, for instance, the Labour Party refusing membership to Karen Ingala-Smith, and possibly some other women, on the basis of them being GC? Can they challenge now?

What about academia? Might this break the pomo/anti-materialist stranglehold on academics? God, I hope so!

[–] jelliknight 13 points (+13|-0)

Just wondering, would there be a case for a class action against stonewall? Stonewall provides false and discriminatory advice to organisations, those organisations act on that adivce to create hostile environments for women, and women lose their jobs or are forced to quit.

[–] womenopausal [OP] witch babe 11 points (+11|-0)

Seems difficult and complicated to prove that chain of events. Organisations are shedding Stonewall at a rate that makes me wonder if there will be much left of the organisation to sue six months down the line.

Anyway, Stonewall will be facing Allison Bailey's suit next. That could be a pivotal moment for Stonewall's future (or lack of it).

Let's see how these things play out first.

[–] RadioLouder 36 points (+36|-0)

Watching the Gender Specials weep over this just drives in how big this was. They thought they had the right to get us sacked for this shit. Suzanne Moore and co have been vindicated now, and I wonder how scared the Grauniad is

[–] worried19 26 points (+26|-0)

I love how the American media is purposely ignoring it, just like they did with Keira Bell.

I went to Google News and clicked the "World" section. No mention of this story. If I search for Forstater, it brings up a handful of overseas articles. The only one that appears to be American-based is from Yahoo News:

https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/woman-who-lost-her-job-but-gained-jk-rowlings-support-over-trans-tweets-wins-appeal-180435503.html

No other American outlets appear to be reporting on it. If you can find any, let me know. It seems to be very intentional. Apparently some fisherman who caught a 6 foot halibut in the North Sea deserves to be linked in the Google News World section, but not Maya Forstater.

[–] Mirren 10 points (+10|-0) Edited

Terrible. In the UK, amusingly, at time of writing, the Guardian doesn't have Maya's win on the front page, but it's still coming up in the most read section.

[–] lucrecia 26 points (+26|-0)

The bbc article is fine comedy. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57426579) Really lays out the absurdity, just by describing the truth.

[–] Foxglove 26 points (+26|-0)

I found this part of the article interesting "Mr Justice Choudhury said her "gender-critical beliefs" did fall under the Equalities Act as they "did not seek to destroy the rights of trans persons".

Trans people are actively seeking to destroy women's rights and they are definitely guilty of harassing women, so shouldn't that exclude them from protection under the equalities act?

[–] lucrecia 12 points (+12|-0)

I think it would just be the belief that they can harass women or erase their rights that wouldn't be included. The belief that there are more than two sexes, or that a person can change sex, would be protected, however silly. Would be interesting to see the court case against someone who campaigned for the removal of women's rights on transactivist grounds, though I suspect they'd look the other way. :(

[–] bellatrixbells 18 points (+18|-0)

They're so pathetic. "This is not the win they will say it is" and "this doesn't mean GCs will be able to misgender trans people with impunity".

So... It means TIPs and their allies can enforce compelled speech ?

Jesus. They might as well have put "😭😭😭" emojis next to the title of the article.

[–] Eava 21 points (+21|-0)

It is such a strawman because there were no transpeople where she worked to misgender, and she has always said that as a common courtesy she would use whatever name/pronouns someone requested and not refer to biological sex unless it was a situation where actual sex was relevant (bathrooms, reserved positions for women, etc.)

[–] LadyGlum 16 points (+16|-0)

They've managed to spread the lies that she was harassing someone at work repeatedly misgendering them extremely efficiently. Those people who've seen it will not be reached by GC people. Media outlets really need to be specifying what she did so people can see the full truth without having to read dozens of pages of legal documents.

[–] KBash 7 points (+7|-0)

I know, I was shocked when I learned she hadn’t misgendered anyone in the workplace at all, and the whole thing was because of some Tweets about believing in biological sex.

Also the first judge saying that a belief in the immutability of biological sex has no place in a civilized society!!!

[–] GCRadFem 25 points (+26|-1)

This needs to start happening in America! I am so happy she won!

[–] Dollita 23 points (+23|-0)

The Court effectively ruled that only where a person’s belief or exercise of speech are aimed at removing the human rights of others should the belief be held to be unworthy of respect. In other words, the exercise of a human right should not be a device for defeating human rights more generally -- Dennis Kavanagh

Is this ruling going to open the door to protecting sex-segregated spaces/sports? I certainly hope so. TRAs can't advocate for rights that would take rights away from actual women without becoming gasp "literal Nazis," a concept that might make a few of them implode.

[–] jelliknight 11 points (+11|-0)

It really sounds like genderism generally could be unprotected speech. Saying that women shouldnt have a right to be e.g. imprisoned away from males is speech aimed at removing the human rights of women and therefore wouldnt be protected.

[–] MenHaveItEasy 22 points (+23|-1)

Way to go Terf Island!

I just got Animal Crossing: NH, and thinking about naming my island that in celebration. =p

[–] SamuraiGhostCat 4 points (+4|-0)

Careful, people can report your island (and Sable Sisters designs). Might even get banned from online play entirely. I personally wouldn’t risk it unless you never see yourself uploading designs or doing online play.

[–] MenHaveItEasy 2 points (+2|-0)

Ah, thanks for the heads up. I dont have Nintendo Online, and dont really play online games. But even if I dont, it will be female only, save for the NPC servants.

[–] IrishTheFrenchie 20 points (+20|-0)

There is an urgent need now to question the wisdom of grouping all LGBT people together as a homogenous single group, classified and defined solely by reference to Gender Theory. For Gender Critical gays and lesbians, transgender status is a wholly different category of characteristic from sexual orientation. The legal right (indeed necessity) of same-sex attracted people to organise together is underlined by this judgment.

YES!!!!! ALLIANCE LGB!

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