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61 comments

[–] phoenix 80 points (+80|-0) Edited

Witnessing the depth of American’s ignorance up close has made Yeonmi question everything about humanity.

"North Koreans, we don't have Internet, we don't have access to any of these great thinkers, we don't know anything. But here, while having everything, people choose to be brainwashed. And they deny it."

Interesting perspective.

[–] suupersami 66 points (+67|-1)

I went to a lower Ivy for the first part of undergrad, and it was like this well before gender woo broke out into society.

As someone from the working class, I was shocked how badly these upper middle class kids tried to self-victimize and police language (especially the language of international students), despite all of the material and social advantages they had. I can't imagine what it must feel like for a North Korean refugee.

[–] goatsauce 15 points (+16|-1)

I'm also working class, and I was actually offered a spot at an Ivy League school, but having heard stories from other friends who had gone there, I decided to go to a less prestigious private university on the west coast. It was honestly not as academically difficult as I would have liked, but culturally, I felt like I didn't stick out as much as my Ivy League friends did. My cousins ran into the same issue as first generation college students when they lamented how many of their peers didn't seem to know how to think so much as they knew how to get answers right on tests. I told her that was normal lol. It's easy to be smart on paper, but it's hard to be able to see through bullshit I suppose.

[–] KBash 6 points (+6|-0)

Being good at the art of bullshit is necessary just to get through college with a decent GPA.

It’s no wonder some people get confused and mistake their own con for reality.

[–] hypatia 11 points (+11|-0)

I honestly think a LOT of problems in today's culture come from privileged kids who are externalizing their guilt.

I think there's truth in this. I was a young teen in the early 90s and came from a comfortable, middle class home. Even back then I had a phase of yearning to be a romanticised, tortured soul. I was obsessed with Laura Palmer the dead girl from the TV show Twin Peaks. Super cringe. Luckily for me there wasn't much outlet for it pre internet so I became a goth for a while then eventually grew up and got over myself.

[–] hypatia 2 points (+2|-0)

Twin Peaks is awesome! And Laura Palmer is full of mysteries :) I was obsessed with Twin Peaks also, but I was obsessed with Audrey Horne.

[–] jelliknight 4 points (+4|-0)

While constructing a fantasy that they "did it all on their own". Which is dangerous because they assume everyone else had the same resources.

[–] Tnetennba [OP] 51 points (+51|-0)

She was also shocked and confused by issues surrounding gender and language, with every class asking students to announce their preferred pronouns.

"English is my third language. I learned it as an adult. I sometimes still say 'he' or 'she' by mistake and now they are going to ask me to call them 'they'? How the heck do I incorporate that into my sentences?"

"It was chaos," said Yeonmi. "It felt like the regression in civilization."

Interesting observations—it goes along with what we've been saying. Obviously this article has a bit of a slant, but overall I thought it was interesting to see her thoughts on this.

[–] [Deleted] 35 points (+35|-0)

And she'd know she lived in a culture where everything you said was controlled. Must be crazy for her to go to a country of so called free speech(speech is only free for men, women always lose something imo) and encounter this nonsense.

[–] orangeypanda 32 points (+35|-3)

I was a big fan of hers, but had to unfollow awhile ago. She became a big fan of Jordan Peterson and I noticed a big switch in her as she started parroting quotes from his book. She was on his podcast a couple weeks ago. Most of her fans appear to be white MRA type men because she caters to them.

She has a video on radical feminism that sums up to "women are the reason men are so irresponsible and disrespectful these days, women being independent ruined men"

She compares toxic masculinity to "toxic feminism".

"The things radical feminism is fighting for now is the destruction of our society"

In a previous video where she spoke about Noth Korea she said the women did 100% of domestic work and were also the bread winners while the men play poker all day. But in this new video she says the the men in North Korea are responsible and take care of women and there is no gender wars like in America that feminists have made apparently.

Her video: North Koreans Thoughts on Radical Feminism https://youtu.be/vGNb6Kj_4ac

North Koreans Perspective on "Victimhood" in America: https://youtu.be/VeNEtDtclO8

Yeonmi: If you view yourself as a victim after being raped and don't move on then you aren't being responsible.

Sorry if I got off-topic, but it really hurt me watching this strong woman get brainwashed by JP.

[–] littleowl12 36 points (+36|-0) Edited

What I hate most about pomo is that it turns people who would otherwise be rational liberals into conservatives. I sort of knew she would go that way for several reasons. I know quite a few people who left communist countries, and they tend to be fiercely conservative in the Western sense of the word. They got the ass end of communism and they get triggered by anything that smacks of newspeak. They don't differentiate between the ideas, and too many Western leftists smugly support communism to be très chic. Which is very off-putting to survivors of it. And they wind up conservative as a result.

To make matters worse, conservatives often charm these survivors by simply fucking listening to them. And believe them. And don't try to rationalize these regimes. We on the left largely don't. I wish we would.

[–] KBash 6 points (+6|-0) Edited

I can’t tell you how angry leftists who uncritically support communism and enforced socialism make me. Why the fuck don’t they speak out against the mass murder and political chaos caused by leftist social engineering?

I agree with you 💯.

People who defend Lenin and Castro and others of their ilk really upset me. They’re a step away from saying they really admire Chairman Mao, Josef Stalin or Pol Pot, if only they hadn’t gotten a couple things wrong. (They also conveniently forget that Hitler and the Third Reich were also self-proclaimed socialists).

A lot of sick shit has been done in the name of communism and socialism. I think this is due to the sometimes sinister nature of an authoritarian leftist idealism mixed with human nature, narcissism and ego, and the drive for power.

That has nothing to do with how moderate socialism works in countries for example such as Sweden.

Similarly, maybe she thinks the people pushing pronouns are “radical feminists.” Feminism keeps getting blamed for this whole mess, after all. I have met very few people using the phrase “radical feminist” irl who actually know what that means, what it stands for, or how it differs from liberal feminist or queer theory beliefs.

So yeah. I agree.

[–] FedUp12345 30 points (+31|-1)

I love Yeonmi Park. Her book was very good, absolutely heartbreaking. Her YouTube channel is very insightful too. She’s a very intelligent and inspiring woman.

[–] lucretiamott 19 points (+19|-0)

I watch her youtube channel too. She's very thoughtful and well spoken, and she has a singular focus of doing whatever she personally can to free North Koreans and get the message out about what's happening there and really how bad it is. Very inspiring. I haven't read her book but it's on my list.

[–] Bombastic 5 points (+17|-12)

I don't want to be an asshole, but she's not a great source for any factual information about North Korea. She left there a long time ago and most of the things she says nowadays are made up. There are articles about it online if you care to look.

[–] FedUp12345 26 points (+28|-2)

Yes I’ve heard of the controversies. I don’t know how you or anyone else could ascertain that what she says is made up. She’s a defector. Have you ever been to NK? Undoubtedly she’s experienced a lot of trauma. She knows more about NK than you or I. I wouldn’t be so quick to dismiss her experiences. Whether or not you care for her personally she’s been through unimaginable horrors and she deserves to have her voice heard.

[–] Bombastic 14 points (+22|-8)

I have in fact been to North Korea, I have studied the country for a long time. The reason her info is often incorrect is because she left a long, long time ago when she was quite young. People don't have much access to information inside the country once that happens. If you watch any of her videos she claims to have all this current insider knowledge that is literally impossible to have and does not add up to the little proven information that we DO have. I'm not dismissive of her experiences before defecting or her story of escape (believe me I have tremendous empathy for defectors) but it's also not cruel to point out when someone is telling lies. There are more reliable defectors out there and I'm just advising people to remain critical and not blindly believe everything.

[–] NotCis 10 points (+14|-4)

What's your source for "most of the things she says nowadays are made up?" How could you possibly know that?

[–] Bombastic -1 points (+11|-12)

She has not lived in North Korea for 14 years! Do you know how North Korea and its government's control of information works? I can't believe I'm getting pushback for pointing out possible fake news, next time you guys can go on believing what you want. 😂

[–] jelliknight 3 points (+5|-2)

The reason you're getting pushback is because this right here is you putting down a refugee as a way of bignoting yourself.

If she has exaggerated some parts of her story, how is that relevant here? Is she unable to compare the US to her experience of NK? Is her YouTube channel not worth listening to?

You arent making any factual claim (she said X but we know Y is true because of Z proof) you're just sledging her character in a way thats irrelevant to the topic being discussed. It has a bit of a playground tattling feel to it.

[–] Althea 27 points (+27|-0)

I read an article a while ago about online drama in the young adult fiction community. One author said, "I've never seen social interaction this fucked up, and I've been in prison."

[–] CacaoGudem 25 points (+25|-0) Edited

During orientation, she was scolded by a university staff member for admitting she enjoyed classic literature such as Jane Austen. "I said ‘I love those books.’ I thought it was a good thing," recalled Park. "Then she said, 'Did you know those writers had a colonial mindset? They were racists and bigots and are subconsciously brainwashing you.’"

Wtf? I love Jane Austen and Regency romance. I even love Sherlock Holmes and EM Forster even these where all written when my ancestors lived under British rule. They are definitely not perfect and have some uncomfortable sentiments but I still enjoyed most of the book. Yes, British colonization was awful but avoiding the classics won't help anything. It will only keep us ignorant because the first step of decolonizing is to understand the colonialist perspective.

[–] LadyGlum 17 points (+17|-0)

There's a strong argument to be made that one of Austen's novels is anti-slavery. These "educated" people are so deeply uneducated it's difficult to fathom it. As if Austen, who criticized the whole of the upper classes regularly, and wasn't so kind towards the middle class either, had anything at all to do with Britain colonizing anywhere. It was illegal to write things that weren't pro-government as well!

As usual, this stuff is just projection. They're being brainwashed and it's easy because all you have to do to get them to not educate themselves is declare something "problematic".

[–] CacaoGudem 7 points (+7|-0)

Which Jane Austen novel is that? I haven't read all of them yet!

People think everything is problematic; it is so exhausting. They are obviously doing it for social standing without realizing they are leading everyone down a purity spiral.

[–] LadyGlum 9 points (+9|-0)

Mansfield Park. I haven't actually read it either, but I've seen a few think pieces on it. A great deal of the criticism, apparently, comes through incredibly veiled references to names that would have been well-known at the time but are now only known to people who study the period, not someone who watched half of Mansfield Park on the television.

I have been repeatedly castigated by woke fools for talking about how "problematic" specific pieces of media are are. You can quite literally be discussing and acknowledging the problems with these things, agreeing with them, and still be judged harshly. They really just don't want people thinking for themselves.

[–] HandsomeCherry 12 points (+12|-0)

They say that but does these staff make efforts to read native malaysian, indian, singaporean authors exclusively and also to include them in the curriculum? The ones from British colonised lands? This is how history repeats itself. No post mo american writers too then bc america still have military bases in the Phillipines and Okinawa 😂. Don't read anything, ever, we only need STEM kids to count.

How did best Universities on earth became like this? Is it the for profit model? Harrowing.

[–] Lumos 25 points (+25|-0)

She’s right. It seems both sides want to destroy everything so they can rebuild it to their liking rather than work with what we have.

[–] RawSienna 18 points (+18|-0)

This aligns with what we GC women and many others have been saying. It’s cultural totalitarianism.

[–] NotCis 16 points (+16|-0)

I think this is a really important article. People in the gender-woo world have lost all perspective - they think that misgendering is a hate crime while people around them and in their very same classes have undergone ACTUAL human rights violations that are staggering in their scope. It is not a crime for people to correctly identify your sex, but more than that, it's not the BIGGEST crime. You want classes to actually be inclusive? Start thinking about how your gender rules exclude people who are getting this educational opportunity for the first time in their lives.

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