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From this comment here that I wrote:

https://www.ovarit.com/o/Radfemmery/38687/like-any-other-job/86f116bd-1a69-4d6f-95de-7c1b5a3ebb24

I had to make an OP about this.

So to copy what I felt was the best part:

Women's orgasms matter. Women deserve orgasms!! The giving of money IS NOT ENOUGH and will NEVER BE ENOUGH to justify taking away women's pleasure! Of erasing her needs for intimacy and joy in sex and in fact damaging her potential for enjoying sex!

All women's pleasure should be cherished. All of it. Sex work inherently justifies erasing women's pleasure and in fact, creating harm (labor) in sex instead.

All of this is all tied to the MYTH that women and girls are not fully human like men are, thus our pleasure doesn't matter and doesn't deserve to be protected and cherished. That its not natural for us to desire sex. And if we demand more than just a penis in a hole, we are sick, hysterical, needy, clinging and unreasonable. Nope.

No little girl ever grows up imagining being a prostitute. Even if she has practically no idea of what sex is, she would never imagine intimacy with a lover (romantic or otherwise) something she wants to be commodified. When we all were little girls having our first ideas of love, none of us imagined being forced to love someone for money. NONE OF US.

So when a grown man says he supports sex workers "choosing" to be sex workers, he supports the crushed dreams of broken girls for his pleasure alone. He supports the continuation of those crushed dreams existing in adult bodies, for his pleasure alone.

Supporting sex work means we women don't have the same need for release and joy and love in sex. And that in fact our sexual and relasionship needs are really not something anyone has to take account of, or care about, or protect.

This means our sexual pleasure is not only not important for us, but it's not important for the health of families and society. And this includes the women who men cheat on with sex workers.

This a major cornerstone of patriarchy if not THE cornerstone, That women exist for men to take their pleasure from however men dicatte, and nothing else! Our desires, dreams, wants, needs, sensitivities, sexual identities and ability to have joy in our bodies are not worth being cherished on their own!!

In fact it's natural to turn our sex acts and sexual identities into a commodity for men's pleasure instead!

So to reiterate.

For sex work as we know it to be considered acceptable for men in society, there has to be a prevailing belief that women do not desire, need or benefit from pleasure in sex the way men do, and that turning sex into a job doesn't inherently mean pain for women. That its okay to damage our dreams, our romance, our joy in our bodies, and our sexual selves, in order for men to get orgasms. That its okay to in fact, damage our bodies (through plastic surgery, dangerous sex acts, high std and pregnancy risk etc.) for mens sexual pleasure.

In order for this view to exist, you have to inherently dehumanize women. Period. End.

You have to believe we are less fragile and less sensitive about sex and intimacy than men. That we are less of a human being than men are!

In fact when the truth is we may be the opposite!!

That is, you have to believe that we can just "take" all the objectification of us, and the penetration of us, like it were a job equal to "flipping burgers."

You have to believe it is a fair exchange to give us money in exchange for our sexual needs not being met, our sexual identities being surrendered to those who can buy us, our pleasure in sex in our bodies being removed, and our sexual psychology being absolutely devalued and exploited.

And, even if you, as a man will object and say "I want women to have pleasure in sex." This is a lie and I am tired of being lied to!!

If you allow or are okay with one woman to be coerced to have sex with someone for money, you are harming all women. You are dehumanizing all women.

You are saying its alright not to cherish the sexual identities and health of women and girls as long as some man somewhere can get off without any effort.

For sex work to be considered a valuable contribution to society, we have to devalue the orgasms of women, while over-valuing the orgasms of men.

We have to believe that it is a part of normal healthy relasionships and development (psychological development, sense of self, connection to others etc) for your sex to be something that is a purchased object for another person to use for their own pleasure while you are not enjoying yourself!! That is normal for your sex to have been twisted into a toil, a struggle, a job.

Sex should always be inherently about pleasure!

(And this is made worse by the fact that all sex workers all trend young, so so many girls who have brains that are not completely grown are being absolutely mentally screwed out of a healthy mind-body connection, and healthy sexual identity, by being sex workers.)

Since women naturally suffer to give birth, our sexual pleasure should be the priority in our society! Men should strive to give us as much pleasure as possible to make up for this!

All of this came up after I dealt with a couple of ugly boomer scrotes (of they were balding, wrinkly fat dudes) on IG arguing with me about sex work being okay as long as a woman "consents" to it.

They used the common arguments that even if you acknowledge ecnomoic coersion it's not really rape because it's still "consent to a job just like any job, and therefore if you think this, then all jobs are abuse."

Ofc this made my head explode as a former sex worker.

This idea that "its still consent to a job just like any job" is part of patriarchy.

Sex is special okay? There. I said it. Human beings are sexual beings and to make sex "a job" is fundamentally inhumane!

It denies how important it is for our psychology, identity, sense of health, belonging and welfare for us to find pleasure in sex.

Men are so self absorbed and stupid they legitimately think they would love sex work, while never actually doing or daring to do sex work themselves.

They never are willing to give up their sexual pleasure like women are expected to, for them.

They are just that stupid they think somehow that they would be able to enjoy having to fuck ugly people every day. Like they would be able to orgasm the same (even if they do), day after day. Even if you could orgasm some of the time, over time you would become fucked up mentally. It's just guaranteed.

Patriarchy inherently think that women's sex is something that is naturally "a labor." They think it's normal for a woman to "work" for men even in the most intimate of ways. To give up everything about herself, even to the most personal level. That our bodies are never personal and private. That our bodies are something any man can make public property if he wants to.

For our most intimate and precious parts of ourselves as human beings (the gift of reproduction) to be stripped into nothing but a thing to buy, is to be removed from all the best parts of relasionships and self-knowing, and especially from self-knowing. Because sex is a major part of self-knowing. Like masturbation. But men want to own that too. They want to own and occupy the self-knowing of women to the point we don't own it ourselves anymore. They want us to surrender it all to men, just so they can bust a nut.

Guys like this think its the natural state for women's orgasms to be faked for their benefit.

Guys like this think women just aren't sexual beings like they are....aka...women are not human like they are. Guys like this want to believe if they were a girl they'd dream of being a prostitute. They don't believe that girls are just like boys - that we don't dream of our futures like this. Ever. No girl or boy dreams of being a prostitute.

So men who think sex work is "just a job like any job" think removing pleasure from sex is no more of a "crushed dream" than having to flip burgers when you wanted to be an astronaut.

This is a lie.

This was kind of long, and I may have been redundant so I might edit this later. But I hope this contributes to people's understanding about how sex work is always bad, its a cornerstone of patriarchy, and it is always rape.

Personal sexual pleasure should ALWAYS be the priority in sex. Nobody willingly consents to have their sexual pleasure removed and turned into a struggle. Nobody mentally healthy consents for sex to become a dead experience for someone elses consumption.

Men will never willingly chose to be sex workers en masse, they will always prefer to be the buyers. Sex work is about sexism and dehumanization of women. Period end.

From this comment here that I wrote: https://www.ovarit.com/o/Radfemmery/38687/like-any-other-job/86f116bd-1a69-4d6f-95de-7c1b5a3ebb24 I had to make an OP about this. So to copy what I felt was the best part: >Women's orgasms matter. Women deserve orgasms!! The giving of money IS NOT ENOUGH and will NEVER BE ENOUGH to justify taking away women's pleasure! Of erasing her needs for intimacy and joy in sex and in fact damaging her potential for enjoying sex! All women's pleasure should be cherished. All of it. Sex work inherently justifies erasing women's pleasure and in fact, creating harm (labor) in sex instead. All of this is all tied to the MYTH that women and girls are not fully human like men are, thus our pleasure doesn't matter and doesn't deserve to be protected and cherished. That its not natural for us to desire sex. And if we demand more than just a penis in a hole, we are sick, hysterical, needy, clinging and unreasonable. Nope. **No little girl ever grows up imagining being a prostitute. Even if she has practically no idea of what sex is, she would never imagine intimacy with a lover (romantic or otherwise) something she wants to be commodified. When we all were little girls having our first ideas of love, none of us imagined being forced to love someone for money. NONE OF US.** So when a grown man says he supports sex workers "choosing" to be sex workers, he supports the crushed dreams of broken girls for his pleasure alone. He supports the continuation of those crushed dreams existing in adult bodies, for his pleasure alone. Supporting sex work means we women don't have the same need for release and joy and love in sex. And that in fact our sexual and relasionship needs are really not something anyone has to take account of, or care about, or protect. This means our sexual pleasure is not only not important for us, but it's not important for the health of families and society. And this includes the women who men cheat on with sex workers. This a major cornerstone of patriarchy if not THE cornerstone, That women exist for men to take their pleasure from however men dicatte, and nothing else! Our desires, dreams, wants, needs, sensitivities, sexual identities and ability to have joy in our bodies are not worth being cherished on their own!! In fact it's natural to turn our sex acts and sexual identities into a commodity for men's pleasure instead! So to reiterate. For sex work as we know it to be considered acceptable for men in society, there has to be a prevailing belief that women do not desire, need or benefit from pleasure in sex the way men do, and that turning sex into a job doesn't inherently mean pain for women. That its okay to damage our dreams, our romance, our joy in our bodies, and our sexual selves, in order for men to get orgasms. That its okay to in fact, damage our bodies (through plastic surgery, dangerous sex acts, high std and pregnancy risk etc.) for mens sexual pleasure. In order for this view to exist, you have to inherently dehumanize women. Period. End. You have to believe we are less fragile and less sensitive about sex and intimacy than men. That we are less of a human being than men are! In fact when the truth is we may be the opposite!! That is, you have to believe that we can just "take" all the objectification of us, and the penetration of us, like it were a job equal to "flipping burgers." You have to believe it is a fair exchange to give us money in exchange for our sexual needs not being met, our sexual identities being surrendered to those who can buy us, our pleasure in sex in our bodies being removed, and our sexual psychology being absolutely devalued and exploited. And, even if you, as a man will object and say "I want women to have pleasure in sex." This is a lie and I am tired of being lied to!! If you allow or are okay with one woman to be coerced to have sex with someone for money, you are harming all women. You are dehumanizing all women. You are saying its alright not to cherish the sexual identities and health of women and girls as long as some man somewhere can get off without any effort. For sex work to be considered a valuable contribution to society, we have to devalue the orgasms of women, while over-valuing the orgasms of men. We have to believe that it is a part of normal healthy relasionships and development (psychological development, sense of self, connection to others etc) for your sex to be something that is a purchased object for another person to use for their own pleasure while you are not enjoying yourself!! That is normal for your sex to have been twisted into a toil, a struggle, a job. Sex should always be inherently about pleasure! (And this is made worse by the fact that all sex workers all trend young, so so many girls who have brains that are not completely grown are being absolutely mentally screwed out of a healthy mind-body connection, and healthy sexual identity, by being sex workers.) Since women naturally suffer to give birth, our sexual pleasure should be the priority in our society! Men should strive to give us as much pleasure as possible to make up for this! All of this came up after I dealt with a couple of ugly boomer scrotes (of they were balding, wrinkly fat dudes) on IG arguing with me about sex work being okay as long as a woman "consents" to it. They used the common arguments that even if you acknowledge ecnomoic coersion it's not really rape because it's still "consent to a job just like any job, and therefore if you think this, then all jobs are abuse." Ofc this made my head explode as a former sex worker. This idea that "its still consent to a job just like any job" is part of patriarchy. Sex is special okay? There. I said it. Human beings are sexual beings and to make sex "a job" is fundamentally inhumane! It denies how important it is for our psychology, identity, sense of health, belonging and welfare for us to find pleasure in sex. Men are so self absorbed and stupid they legitimately think they would love sex work, while never actually doing or daring to do sex work themselves. They never are willing to give up their sexual pleasure like women are expected to, for them. They are just that stupid they think somehow that they would be able to enjoy having to fuck ugly people every day. Like they would be able to orgasm the same (even if they do), day after day. Even if you could orgasm some of the time, over time you would become fucked up mentally. It's just guaranteed. Patriarchy inherently think that women's sex is something that is naturally "a labor." They think it's normal for a woman to "work" for men even in the most intimate of ways. To give up everything about herself, even to the most personal level. That our bodies are never personal and private. That our bodies are something any man can make public property if he wants to. For our most intimate and precious parts of ourselves as human beings (the gift of reproduction) to be stripped into nothing but a thing to buy, is to be removed from all the best parts of relasionships and self-knowing, and especially from self-knowing. Because sex is a major part of self-knowing. Like masturbation. But men want to own that too. They want to own and occupy the self-knowing of women to the point we don't own it ourselves anymore. They want us to surrender it all to men, just so they can bust a nut. Guys like this think its the natural state for women's orgasms to be faked for their benefit. Guys like this think women just aren't sexual beings like they are....aka...women are not human like they are. Guys like this want to believe if they were a girl they'd dream of being a prostitute. They don't believe that girls are just like boys - that we don't dream of our futures like this. Ever. No girl or boy dreams of being a prostitute. So men who think sex work is "just a job like any job" think removing pleasure from sex is no more of a "crushed dream" than having to flip burgers when you wanted to be an astronaut. This is a lie. This was kind of long, and I may have been redundant so I might edit this later. But I hope this contributes to people's understanding about how sex work is always bad, its a cornerstone of patriarchy, and it is always rape. Personal sexual pleasure should ALWAYS be the priority in sex. Nobody willingly consents to have their sexual pleasure removed and turned into a struggle. Nobody mentally healthy consents for sex to become a dead experience for someone elses consumption. Men will never willingly chose to be sex workers en masse, they will always prefer to be the buyers. Sex work is about sexism and dehumanization of women. Period end.

5 comments

And I think this post would be a great fit in o/WomensLiberation too, because it’s a great discussion starter and so well written, and you give voice to so many things women are thinking but that are taboo to talk about outside of feminist spaces, so we rarely even see it all put down in words!

Your viewpoint as a former sex worker provides insight that men may not want to hear, but that women MUST hear, IMO. I think if more women knew about radical feminism (and not libfems) and read this message, they would be all ears. I’m really hoping there will be a tipping point soon.

Thanks, I am not so sure about the writing here it definitely needs editing. But thank you! It's really hard to put down into words how fucked up it is.