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It drives me up the wall when men complain about the stigmas they face when it comes to mental health. Therapy is something that exists, they don't ban men from it, you just don't want your bros mocking you the way they mock women who have mental health issues. Men are incredibly cruel to mentally ill women, to the point of targeting us to sexually and emotionally and physically abuse us because they know we're more vulnerable. Men mock us for the emotional issues caused by abusive or neglectful fathers. Men relentlessly accuse us of faking disorders for attention or lying or being pathetic and weak whenever we're open about our struggles, or even if we just dare to be attractive and struggling. Obviously all beautiful women live life on easy mode so they're all faking it for... pity? Tumblr clout? Instagram likes??

Men are incredibly fucking cruel to us, regardless of how we look! It's not EASIER to be a mentally ill woman, women are just more likely to be responsible and mature enough to seek help from people who are qualified and paid to deal with our problems when we need it.

And a lot of these same men? Looooove using the women in their lives as therapists and agony aunts. I cannot tell you how many times a dude I don't even know has started talking to me about all his issues mere minutes/hours/days after meeting me. I cannot tell you how many times each of my friends and I have been used as a living emotional crutch by some random dude who thinks that US helping THEM means that we owe them sex. I cannot tell you how many times I had to be my father's emotional support as a child. And then they'll turn right back around and talk shit about mentally ill women when mentally ill men are the ones so much more likely to hurt other people. They just hate mentally ill women for existing, for having the audacity to struggle. Don't we know that having a vagina means that everything is easier for us?!

So I have very little patience with men struggling to open up about their mental health to their bros. That is their responsibility, a problem that toxic masculinity has perpetuated. Women are BEGGING men to go to therapy and stop dumping this on us. THERAPISTS would be more than willing to get more clients. Men simply don't want to perform the emotional labor and introspection that therapy requires of them. The only thing they seem to want is pity sex.

It drives me up the wall when men complain about the stigmas they face when it comes to mental health. Therapy is something that exists, they don't ban men from it, you just don't want your bros mocking you the way they mock women who have mental health issues. Men are incredibly cruel to mentally ill women, to the point of targeting us to sexually and emotionally and physically abuse us because they know we're more vulnerable. Men mock us for the emotional issues caused by abusive or neglectful fathers. Men relentlessly accuse us of faking disorders for attention or lying or being pathetic and weak whenever we're open about our struggles, or even if we just dare to be attractive and struggling. Obviously all beautiful women live life on easy mode so they're all faking it for... pity? Tumblr clout? Instagram likes?? Men are incredibly fucking cruel to us, regardless of how we look! It's not EASIER to be a mentally ill woman, women are just more likely to be responsible and mature enough to seek help from people who are qualified and paid to deal with our problems when we need it. And a lot of these same men? Looooove using the women in their lives as therapists and agony aunts. I cannot tell you how many times a dude I don't even know has started talking to me about all his issues mere minutes/hours/days after meeting me. I cannot tell you how many times each of my friends and I have been used as a living emotional crutch by some random dude who thinks that US helping THEM means that we owe them sex. I cannot tell you how many times I had to be my father's emotional support as a child. And then they'll turn right back around and talk shit about mentally ill women when mentally ill men are the ones so much more likely to hurt other people. They just hate mentally ill women for existing, for having the audacity to struggle. Don't we know that having a vagina means that everything is easier for us?! So I have very little patience with men struggling to open up about their mental health to their bros. That is their responsibility, a problem that toxic masculinity has perpetuated. Women are BEGGING men to go to therapy and stop dumping this on us. THERAPISTS would be more than willing to get more clients. Men simply don't want to perform the emotional labor and introspection that therapy requires of them. The only thing they seem to want is pity sex.

38 comments

[–] BlackCirce 36 points (+37|-1)

Men make a conscious choice between getting help for their problems but being weak and feminine, or pretending they don’t have a problem and being masculine. They actively choose being in pain, being dysfunctional, being hyper aggressive, abusive, broken and sui- and or homocidal over being emasculated. It’s their choice and it’s not the goal of the women’s liberation movement to convince men to be more feminine to save their lives.

The idea that it’s somehow “easier” for women to be mentally ill, propped up by suicide completion rates, right along side the idea that it’s “easier” and less humiliating for women to report sexual assault/rape and domestic violence allows men to persist in their fantasy that they are the ones truly oppressed. That relieves them of any political or social responsibility to improve women’s condition.

I think therapy makes men worse anyway, because therapy involves validation of the patient’s feelings and a lot of men’s mental problems come from their sense of entitlement. Just ask them. They’re mad about: random women who won’t have sex with them, wives who won’t cook what they want or get the boob job they want, girlfriends who work in high powered jobs, kids who won’t obey etc. The last thing these entitled men need is a 26 year old woman in a pencil skirt and heels telling them “wow your wife sounds like she has internalized misogyny, the way she keeps haranguing you about your porn viewing habits.” And if therapists do have the gall to tell these entitled men that they need to get themselves together and make positive changes that don’t involve giving the women in their lives extra emotional burdens, men individually and as a group will come down on therapy as “misandrist” and refuse to participate.

It all comes down to choice. Women choose to go to therapy and try to improve ourselves, because we want to, because we’ve been told there must be something wrong with us, because we don’t want to hurt our families by killing ourselves. We deal with the stigma of being madwomen, of being labeled unreliable and irrational, and we power through. That’s just yet another way women are better than men. Men don’t want to be associate with our strength, our sociability, our commitment to the community. They want to be manly. Let them!

[–] FireproofWitch 26 points (+27|-1)

It’s an excellent point you’ve raised about men and therapy. The number of times I’ve heard abusive men use the language they learned in therapy to gaslight their partners and make them walk on eggshells can’t be a coincidence. They go to therapy not to improve themselves, but to find another avenue to bring down the people around them and get others to cater to their emotional whims.

Men’s collective mental health and sense of self will truly improve, I’d wager, when they navel gaze less about their perceived ‘loss’ of rights, and instead choose to shoulder more of the responsibility in creating a better world.

[–] Alecto 8 points (+8|-0)

I don't understand how men can take everything good in this world and manage to turn it into a weapon.

[–] levitation [OP] 1 points (+1|-0)

Yeah therapy usually makes abusive men WORSE unless the therapist knows ahead of time, usually via court mandate, that they're dealing with an abuser. Abusive men are masterful manipulators and liars who often accuse their victims of verbally or emotionally abusing them and thus "provoking" whatever physical violence they mete out.

[–] A_Matriarch 25 points (+25|-0) Edited

They want to be manly, let them!

Whoooo that’s
fire 🔥 You’re so right.

I remember a few years ago reading about the multi million dollar self help industry and how writers and publishers barely bother to write books for men because they’ve proven they won’t buy them, only women do. The self help section in every store across the country is propped up by women’s dollars and women’s good character to know when they need to fix themselves in the first place.. men don’t do this. Men bought that book “The game” , in droves however, the manual written by men who teach other men how to manipulate hoards of random women into sex.

[–] levitation [OP] 1 points (+1|-0)

Men would rather lie to and manipulate women than actually improve themselves in any way. Even guys like Jordan Peterson, who men worship, usually have a bunch of sexist talking points to draw them in because they're so incapable of seeing themselves as the problem.

Great point. It reminds of a friend of my dad, who was so proudly talking about his therapy where he learned that his problem was that his mother and first three wives were "men" (translation: women who did their jobs raising children, putting food on the table and not taking shit from him), but now thanks to therapy he's found a feminine woman who wears make and earrings and is finally happy. His words. I later found out that the woman he brought with him was not the 4th wife I know he has, but a mistress of 12 years. I felt really bad for her. She was a nice woman, 20 years younger than him, who I assume has really low self esteem.

[–] mil-bil 4 points (+5|-1) Edited

I really appreciate how you've explored the complexity here. These days, when I hear the word "validation," I'm close to breaking out in hives.

There's a dearth of therapists today who would give clients practical goals to work toward. Nodding along to the clients' monologues/lists of grudges is easier (and you might actually make more money off them that way!).

Cognitive Behavioral Therapy has gotten a bad rap in recent years. I suppose it's because it actually requires that the clients DO stuff -- actually create change in their lives and take responsibility for their actions.

[–] Jinera 1 points (+3|-2)

As someone who has received cbt therapy for 6+ years from a variety of therapists and who knows several people having finished their psychology degree... the whole thing with cbt is that you do exactly nothing. Aside from telling patients that the way they think is wrong.

Men can get personality disorders, anxiety and depression, developmental disorders.. to act like they shouldn't go to therapy for it is actually sick. Everyone suffering with mental health issues deserves help, regardless of sex.

[–] mil-bil 1 points (+2|-1)

Thank you for your reply. Our experiences with CBT have been very different. I think helping clients recognize and intervene in negative thought patterns can have considerable benefits. I'm not arguing that it's the be all and end all of therapeutic approaches -- it isn't, and not all approaches will necessarily work for all clients.

I'm not sure how the second half of your comment relates to anything I've written. At no point did I argue or imply that some people should not have access to therapy. That's not a position I endorse.

[–] levitation [OP] 0 points (+0|-0)

Right? All these stigmas come from OTHER MEN. They perpetuate it themselves. They use it as a gotcha card whenever women dare to talk about sexism. I really cannot give a shit about men as a class because they create all their own problems!! I often feel bad for individual or marginalized men, but they're still gonna be sexist so I don't owe them my time and energy unless they reciprocate. And most of them don't.

[–] bunyip -1 points (+1|-2) Edited

I'm not here to defend any entitled men, but I think mental health is stigmatized for everyone with mental health issues.

I also think the stigma is caused by all of society, not just men. It's not only men who will mock a man with mental illness, there are women out there too who propagate the conservative stereotypes that men need to "man up" and ignore what's wrong with them, or else they're worthless. Mental illness sucks for everyone.

The idea that it’s somehow “easier” for women to be mentally ill

It's two sides of the same coin of sexist stereotypes. Society often treats women like children, doesn't take women seriously or see them as competent and capable... and if the woman is known to have mental health issues, any chance of being treated equally is gone. But from the male POV, it's easier because he has a lot to lose. He is valued and respected as a strong and capable and useful member of society. Women often aren't, so they don't have as much to lose. He is afraid of having his social status lowered to that of a woman.

[–] BlackCirce 4 points (+4|-0)

there are women out there too who propagate the conservative stereotypes that men need to "man up" and ignore what's wrong with them, or else they're worthless.

When women are supportive of male emotional expressions, we are accused of emasculating men. Especially if we are the wife or mother of the man in question. A sensitive, well socialized man is called a “momma’s boy,” “pussy whipped,” “cuck” and “simp.”

We aren’t all in this together. Men have control of the culture, and this is how they like it. Blaming women does no good, because we are not the cause of the problem.

He is afraid of having his social status lowered to that of a woman.

That’s. What. I. Said! This is the whole theme of my comment.

Men choose high social status (be manly and masculine) over saving their own lives. That’s their choice. It’s not women’s problem, it’s not an issue women can solve.

Men can decide “being alive and healthy and productive and moral is more important to me than masculine status” but for the most part they don’t. They’d rather die a real man than live a “simp” so let them.

Women often aren't, so they don't have as much to lose.

This makes as much sense as saying it’s easier for someone with one leg to lose the second one, than for someone with two legs to lose one. It’s fundamentally sexist and illogical.

Men have more, so they are losing less by admitting they have a problem. People look at them like “wow, this man had a mental problem and did the bare minimum to get healthy, what a king. He’s so brave!”

Whereas for the smallest reaction to abuse women would be put into the asylum or now diagnosed with multiple mental illnesses and put on antidepressants.

And that’s not even mentioning how male mental disturbances are framed as healthy and virtuous.

Even for men with the most depraved psychopathy people will search in his life history for abusive parents, frigid wives, cruel teachers, anyone to blame, so that these men (geniuses really!) can be relieved of personal responsibility.

I’m not buying it. Women have more to lose, because we have so little, and we risk that in order to improve ourselves, because our mental problems are always blamed on us. Men can’t tolerate the slightest, most survivable loss in status.