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And OF COURSE, the image has to be that of a woman in underwear. So progressive!

I was scrolling for this comment.

What the fuck with that picture??? It's not even an "empowering" sexy picture, it's just completely objectifying and reducing her to a thong and ass while she hangs her head in shame.

[–] FeminineMistake 46 points Edited

It’s not even clear that she’s conscious. It’s an image of a limp, undressed, dehumanized female body. Ugh.

I thought that even lib fems used to get mad at sexist advertising, but I guess that's just soooo 2005.

That must be the “fat sex worker” they’re referring to. Since of course, if you equate “transwomen” with Black women and fat women (especially if they’re so stunning and brave and empowered that they take their body-pride to sex work), you’re probably the first one to call size 10 “fat”.

It's so fucking annoying how they keep using black women as an analogy.

People are BORN black.

People are not born trans and they are not born fat. Those two states are choices stemming from mental illnesses and eating disorders. Being mentally ill and delusional is not the same as a biological state of existence.

I swear these people think being black is just a made up concept. Like I choose to have nappy hair and darker skin and a round nose. Like I choose to be discriminated against for this trivial shit and the stupid shit racists associate it with.

[–] Tq231442 35 points Edited

I'm really tired of these MRA leaning on the racist insinuating that black women are masculine. A lot of black women's features are basically staples of traditional femininity - curves, lips, big beautiful eyes. I'm really sick of the subtle insults.

Edit I'm not black but live in a city with a large black population, and whoever thinks black women are masculine clearly doesn't interact with them or even see them regularly 🙄 how insulting

I have no shit seen TiMs say that black women have broader shoulders and bigger muscles than white woman, and those are coded as masculine, so if you believe that black women are women you can’t deny that transwomen are women just because their penises are coded as masculine. It’s completely demented and incredibly awful.

I think they are trying to spin it into 'Being against Transwomen is being RACIST' and use black women as bait. It really is sickening and I don't understand why other liberals don't call them out on it.

Exactly. They always have to piggyback trans rights on to some other cause that people strongly believe in - racism, gay rights - because what they are demanding doesn't stand up to reasoned debate on its own.

[–] remove_the_veil 11 points Edited

Yes, this is their actual tactic! They know trans rights are not popular so they purposefully attached it to other causes.

[–] RisingUp 20 points Edited

You have to assume that the people who go along with that actually do think black women are like men. I think it’s an American thing? From outside their very specific and very insular and very very fucking racist perspective, the whole argument and its underlying assumptions are self-evidently insane.

I don't dare to say it's an American thing because I'm out of the loop, but I haven't heard of it down here so far. The 'noble savage' theory is still quite rampant here unfortunately.

[–] ProxyMusic 16 points Edited

People are not born trans and they are not born fat. Those two states are choices stemming from mental illnesses and eating disorders.

Whilst babies aren't born fat, it's normal and healthy for them to gain quite a lot of weight consisting of large amounts of adipose tissue quickly in the weeks and months after birth. In babies being fat is par for the course and seen as evidence of robust good health.

As for people who aren't babies, not everyone who is fat has an eating disorder. Many fat people have disorders of metabolism that are due to health issues, including diseases and disabilities, and medical treatments, not the result of choice. Genetics and environmental factors such as endocrine disrupters seem to play a role too.

Women in particular often become predisposed to gaining and holding on to fat over the course of life due to such physical factors as childbearing, menopause, aging and declining health in the decades after menopause - and because of many socioeconomic factors too.

There may be a lot of factors, but the rate of obesity and weight issues has increased dramatically over the last half century so that more than two thirds of the US is overweight now. That might be due to genetics, or more likely things the FDA should have regulated better, but it also has to be partially due to the fact that life is way more automated and food is way cheaper. People pay to work out, instead of getting paid to work - people get paid to sit around and organize work (send emails or order shipments or press buttons) way more commonly than burning calories on the job themselves.

And entertainment has become more and more sitting on the couch in front of a screen, not going out, walking around all night, talking, dancing, playing games. Watching TV used to be very limited by what was playing that night, so some nights you really could not do much if you didn't go out - at least you had to walk to the local video rental place, which was evidence of a pretty boring life, but even that included getting out of the house plus you'd probably keep your ears open for other options. Nowadays you can just go sit on your couch and watch whatever every night without even thinking about it.

Which is all to say, it's not an individual failing, but it's not an inescapable condition either. We're living in a world where it's harder to stay healthy, but it should still be the goal. Saying it's "not an eating disorder" but it may be the result of some kind of "disorder not choice" isn't really disagreeing - eating disorders aren't a choice either. Whether they're categorized as disorders or medical issues, the point is that for a lot of people, it's not healthy and treatment can help. The numbers have gone up too fast to shrug it off as genetics.

It's true, but again that's not reason to blanket state that everyone who's overweight is overweight because they have a mental illness.

And if this is a US specific problem, then it's good to put it in context. The US isn't the entire world, and it doesn't seem like even most of the people here are from there.

People are BORN black

TRAs think its possible to change one's sex simply by changing clothes & getting a haircut. So of course they can't wrap their heads around blackness, whiteness, etc being different than being fat or being a prostitute

Do you seriously believe every fat person has an eating disorder, and fat women aren't entitled to inclusion and respect?

I don’t think u/notyourfetish said, or even implied that overweight women don’t deserve inclusion or respect.

Having mental health issues does not make one innately bad/invaluable.

Neither does being "fat" Body weight is not a proxy for mental health. There are plenty of thin people walking around with mental health issues, some related to weight/body image, some completely unrelated. Same with "fat" people.

Not the first time she made that point, too. She also stated that there is "no such thing" as naturally thin women and ignored me when I confronted her about it. I really don't understand why she says such things.

Because people who work very hard at being thin like to lord their "superiority" over others. It really is a disorder in and of itself, anorexic thrive on the idea that they are do disciplined and in control that they can enjoy starving themselves and/or spending hours a day exercising.

Another libfem company claiming that Black women and fat women are the same as men in lipstick

So...I just looked up WTF The Spark Company is, and apparently they sell feminist GRRL POWAH apparel and accessories (most likely sewn by slave children in Bangladesh or whatever). They have quite a few Notorious RBG t-shirts. Someone should inform them that Ginsberg famously campaigned for equal rights on the basis of SEX. Not equal rights on the basis of one's internal, ephemeral girly soul.

They also have "the future is female" shirts. Which is hella transphobic!!

Best of all, they have a mug that says "no thank you". I suspect it won't be there for long. LOL 😏

Ha, when I looked it up the first result was an ad: "The Spark Company-MEN'S Feminist T-shirts." So I think we know what they're about.

One of the handmaidens in the comments is going "yes but these are all women who are often being excluded from feminism". What lol ? When were fat women excluded from feminism ? Black women in segregated nations... Yes... But feminism also exists in Arab, Asian, African countries...

I really had to hold back from telling her that she was ridiculously clueless. Didn't want to doxx myself.

Ah the old “black women, female sex workers, fat women are women too”.

Just come out and say you’re an racist undercover MRA already.

Why is an analogizing black women with men in dresses always their first move? Do they not understand how much insight it gives into the cesspool that is their minds? How many layers of racism and misogyny and horrific old tropes must inform their thinking?

Well when even black men masculinize us that just gives TRAs carte blanche to say whatever about us. Then there’s assholes like Hoe Rogan who say black women have “VERY dense bones”. Even our own black men compare us to monkeys, saying we’re “too dark” to be considered feminine, our own hair that grows out of our heads isn’t “beautiful”, white/ Asian women are trophies, “spicy” Latina are also trophies, we’re not desirable because physically speaking we remind them of self hatred and even perhaps the women that abused them. Aka their mother, grandmother, aunt, older sister, etc.

So yeah when even your own men don’t protect you, other races treat you like an ugly target. That includes TRAs.

What the actual fuck, they do that ?????? That's appalling. FFS "your hair isn't beautiful" well then neither is yours, you twat !?

It astonishes me when men criticize qualities that they have in us and somehow imagine that we would be attracted to them. If black are so repulsive because of their blackness, then why would black men be attractive ?

Also, I do see, every once in a while, black men who speak of "white bitches" as trophies and I'm like... Why would I want to be with a guy who sees me as a collectible rather than a human being ?

I'm enraged for you. 😠

Kind of nervous because first post and I think it fits this circle?

Bit of background: I was scrolling through facebook, noticed this company as sponsored content and decided to take a peak. I instantly rolled my eyes at this picture (what is it with thinking that we consider some obvious women as not real women? WHAT?!) but some of the top comments give me a tiny sliver of hope and I really, REALLY need some hope, people.

"Hey girls, you don't have to be a pretty white woman to matter. "

*Posts faceless sex object in a red thong

Hahaha why would you be nervous ? 🙂 The worst that can happen is the thread gets locked and a mod tells you to repost in the right circle 🙂

ETA Also "mouton électrique" hahahhaah I love it

I'm still a bit worried I offend people. I'm unfriendly but not out there to hurt people, or something. I don't know. :P

And thank you!

Ha ! You'd be pretty unlucky to offend anyone with posts about sexism and libfem idiocy on her 🙂 Welcome to the mean witch coven hahah ! 😉

[–] darr 28 points

hahahahaha WE DON'T BELIEVE IN EXCLUDING ANY WOMAN - EXCEPT FOR AN ENTIRE GROUP OF WOMEN honestly it's laughable that they can't see the logical inconsistency WITHIN ONE SENTENCE

I know it's been said a million times, but it bears repeating: the way they keep lumping black women in with TIMs is appalling.

It’s literally what made me peak. Like can they please leave us out of that mess???

And notice how in their list of "all women" to include, TIMs were first.

[–] AnneLister 9 points Edited

The phrasing is so goddamn funny. Equality isn't equality if it excludes some people - terfs not welcome here! And the fact that their "respect women" pic is a half-naked faceless WOC in sexy underwear with her arse hanging out of her thong? Hello??

Glad to see some sanity after seeing so much insanity on reddit today, ugh. This is refreshing! I don't even know what this company is but if they are meant to cater to women maybe they should consider not caping for men and pretending the sex slave industry is legitimate and something to be glorified. That is, if they don't want to alienate their customer base.

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