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Book ClubsWhy Does He Do That? by Lundy Bancroft | The Abusive Man in the World, Abusive Men and their Allies | Chapter 11
Posted February 24, 2024 by Unicorn in Books

Welcome to another discussion post for Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft.

In this post, we are discussing Part III, The Abusive Man in the World, Chapter 11 Abusive Men and their Allies.

Share your thoughts on this chapter and overal book section in the comments. (Feel free to also share thoughts and suggestions on the discussion post and bookclub structure itself.)

Anyone who hasn't read the book but wants to give input on the topics discussed are welcome to as well! (I recommend mentioning that you haven't read the chapter in your post, so people are aware of that when replying.)

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6 comments

Unicorn [OP]February 24, 2024

In this chapter, Lundy goes over various types of allies to abusive men, this can be his friends and family, his victim's friends and family, neighbors, judges, therapists, attorneys, and so on.

I like the parts where Lundy is optimistic about how abused women have more ways to protect herself and social stigma around acknowledging abusive men has gone down so her community can help her get out of her abusive relationship.

Outside the mainstream of psychological thinking there are many, many excellent practitioners and theorists, ones who take the impact of trauma and abuse seriously and who believe that most victims are telling the truth. The writings of theorists and practitioners such as Judith Herman, Bessel van der Kolk, Peter Jaffe, Angela Browne, John Myers, Susan Schechter, Anna Salter, Beverly James, and countless others serve to counter the hostility toward the oppressed of the prevailing professional atmosphere.

Reference for anyone who is interested in reading more about trauma-informed therapy.

The argument that “he is a human being, too, and he deserves emotional support” should not be used as an excuse to support a man’s abusiveness.

I appreciate how Lundy emphasizes this point consistently throughout the book. It prevents the reader from falling into an abuser's lull and excusing their abusive behavior.


The following is a quote dump that I was originally going to write more reflections on for my main comment about the chapter, but I forgot to and I'm probably not gonna get around to it anymore at this point. 🫠 But I still want to share the quotes because I think they are good and resonated with me.

[O]ne fundamental dynamic has changed little despite three decades of progress in social attitudes toward abuse: No one wants to believe that his or her own son or brother is an abusive man.

...

They have perhaps seen with their own eyes how she “overreacts” to certain things he does in public, because with no idea of what he has been doing to her behind closed doors, they can’t accurately judge her behavior.

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[M]y clients smoothly make up stories to cover their worst incidents. But whether or not he is telling the truth is almost beside the point; he is playing to the societal value, still widely held, that a man’s abuse toward a woman is significantly less serious if she has behaved rudely herself.

...

What her family and friends may not know is that when an abused woman refuses to “look at her part” in the abuse, she has actually taken a powerful step out of self-blame and toward emotional recovery. She doesn’t have any responsibility for his actions. Anyone who tries to get her to share responsibility is adopting the abuser’s perspective.

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The mothers ask me [referring to her abusive ex's new female partner who is trying to help the abuser get custody]: “Does she realize what she is doing? Has she bothered to think about what it’s like for a mother to be threatened with losing her children? What if he turns around years from now and does the same thing to her?”

At the same time, I believe it’s important not to judge the new partner too harshly. I sometimes say to women, “You know how manipulative he can be, and he is sure to be feeding her carefully crafted distortions. I’m not saying you should excuse her actions, I’m just reminding you that the one behind it all is him, not her. If you pour energy into hating her, you are inadvertently serving his interests.”

...

People who are attracted to power and tend to abuse it have important common ground with a man who abuses women. [...] The abuser of power feels outraged when his or her victims attempt to defend themselves in these ways and considers them to be the unreasonable or aggressive ones.

...

This chapter made me realize how lucky I was. My family and friends all hated my ex. They didn't know the extent of the abuse but they could see he was controlling. Even his own mother would take my side when he was shitty with me in front of his family. I'm sure he trash-talked me to everyone after I left, but at least I didn't have to deal with it when I was going through the abuse.

Unicorn [OP]March 2, 2024

I'm so glad you got out of that relationship and I'm so happy you had a support network that stayed by your side. Props to his own mother for standing up for you!

I'm sure he trash-talked me to everyone after I left

My mother told me how my dad literally trash-talked her to all their mutual friends and family when she told him she was done being with him. (And he trash-talked her to me too... I was a tween and he could make sure I knew how "selfish" my mom was and painted anything she did badly. Parental alienation.) He sent out a mass email making himself the victim and painting my mom as a villain, and he wanted people to "sign their support for him" for it. When she told me this I couldn't believe his behavior. She said the most hurtful part was that her own mother agreed with him. I feel so bad for what she went through during that time.

This book makes me feel so mad at times. It reminds me of so many painful things women have had to go through, all due to the choices and actions of abusive men. We need more justice. Touching grass isn't enough.

Ugh. I'm so sorry you and your mom went through that.

I find it fascinating how abusers don't realize how ridiculous they are. Sending out a mass email asking people to sign their support for him? WTF.

This book makes me feel angry, too. But it's kind of a consolation to see just how similar abusers are, and how many other women have fallen for this type of guy. I hate that it's so common, but it kind of makes me feel less stupid. There's a point in the next chapter where the author mentions something that was so similar amongst the abusers he worked with (can't remember what it was now) that it seemed his clients all went to the same Abusers Academy. It's so true! It's like they're all cut from the same cookie cutter.

Unicorn [OP]March 3, 2024

But it's kind of a consolation to see just how similar abusers are, and how many other women have fallen for this type of guy. [...] It's like they're all cut from the same cookie cutter.

I think that's why I like this book, it shows what a "scam" an abusive man is and how "predictable" they are, in a sense. I remember the phrase "once you can name something, you have power over it." Knowledge of abuser's tactics is power.

Now I understand why it's one of those books that's like "every woman needs to read this," because if every woman did read it, abusers would have way less power.

"once you can name something, you have power over it."

YES. I remember the first time someone called my ex a narcissist. That had never occurred to me before. But I had now had a new word to describe him, and that gave me a whole new perspective.