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I mostly dress fairly practically and comfortably. For work, I wear the same uniform as the men, same brand shoes, and same brand jacket with no makeup and hair up. At home, I usually wear workout clothes or pjs. However, on occasion I do like to wear something pretty if going out with friends.

Having seen TIM’s shove themselves into revealing dresses, toddle in painful heals, and wear caked on makeup while doing woman-face it just all feels somehow more ridiculous though. Seeing men force themselves into those molds and stand next to regular men in much more comfortable, practical, and less sexually demeaning clothes really drives home how awful a lot of the culturally driven things from performative femininity are. Recently, this led to me opting to wear a much more comfortable pant suit to a wedding and even interviewing in a nice set of dress boots rather than heals.

I wondered if anyone else had found themselves looking at performative femininity more critically after seeing how ludicrous watching the men doing it was?

I mostly dress fairly practically and comfortably. For work, I wear the same uniform as the men, same brand shoes, and same brand jacket with no makeup and hair up. At home, I usually wear workout clothes or pjs. However, on occasion I do like to wear something pretty if going out with friends. Having seen TIM’s shove themselves into revealing dresses, toddle in painful heals, and wear caked on makeup while doing woman-face it just all feels somehow more ridiculous though. Seeing men force themselves into those molds and stand next to regular men in much more comfortable, practical, and less sexually demeaning clothes really drives home how awful a lot of the culturally driven things from performative femininity are. Recently, this led to me opting to wear a much more comfortable pant suit to a wedding and even interviewing in a nice set of dress boots rather than heals. I wondered if anyone else had found themselves looking at performative femininity more critically after seeing how ludicrous watching the men doing it was?

88 comments

Great post. And, yes. I'm much less inclined to engage in performative femininity than in my youth, and I think men displaying bad womanface, whether it be hulking female-identifying men or drag queens in grotesque clownish makeup, were a large part of that.

I was never someone who was into the modern trend of drag style of makeup (fake eyelashes, long acrylic nails etc.) but now after peaking and finding radical feminism I find the whole look ridiculous and almost clown-like for women to wear seriously.

The funny thing about the kind of skimpy dresses that Tims try to pull off are they usually worn by women who have svelte hour-glass figures as they emphasise curves which obviously males do not possess. Tims often end up looking like rectangular fridges stuffed into them and certainly women who have more boxy bodies wouldn't even dream of wearing those kind of clothes. In addition to looking ridiculous it also shows their complete lack of understanding of the female socialisation of being self-conscious and dressing for your figure.

[–] bellatrixbells BoobatrixRex 46 points

"Tims often end up looking like rectangular fridges stuffed into them "

HAHAH this !

I think we all saw something looking absolutely fabulous on someone else and tried it on ourselves only to look terrible in it.

This applies to males also. Different things flatter different physiques, but TIMs seem to have a very set vision of what a woman is, and therefore what it wears and they just put this on themselves as a one size fits all.

[–] [Deleted] 23 points Edited

They fetishize themselves so much that they're incapable of seeing how bad they look. It's very clear that the only versions of femininity they pursue are either fetishized small child, fetishized underage anime girl, or fetishized porn actress. And these clothes look awful. Most of those outfits look silly/trashy even on conventionally attractive women, but on men they're either comedic or downright unsettling.

Some TIMs MIGHT be able to pull off an age-appropriate wardrobe that hides the masculine features they claim to have such dysphoria over, but they all seem to go out of their way to dress in shit that looks terrible on them and prominently shows off their male anatomy. (Adams apples, shoulders, beer guts, body hair, their gender euphoric girldicks...)

[–] bellatrixbells BoobatrixRex 8 points

I agree. Doesn't it give them major dysphoria ?

Nah, just the clothes give them "euphoria" 😑

🎶 see the Tim stuffed in a dress / see him looking like a mess / Fridge Man 🎶

*with apologies to Soundgarden

Eddie Izzard's bright pink lipstick is another fashion fail, which is a shame since he used to wear lipstick that suited his coloring, more of a dark burgundy. It's funny that he adopted better fashion as an "executive transvestite" than as a "she/her".

'women who have more boxy bodies wouldn't even dream of wearing those kind of clothes'

Not sure why, but that comment really hit me. I remember when I was much younger, and much more of a clothes horse, avoiding a particular style that looked amazing on a friend of mine because I had straight shoulders, rather than the elegant sloping shoulders my friend had. 'I look like a football player in this', I laughed, and even though I loved the way those dresses looked on her I chose not to wear them. Female socialisation!

Tims often end up looking like rectangular fridges stuffed into them

It’s especially jarring with their too-high and too far apart stuffed chest lumps on their barrel chests (I’m sorry, they’re not breasts). They look fucking ridiculous.

[–] Gladys_Kravitz 13 points Edited

I don't know how to feel about this, because the last time the subject of widely spaced breasts came up, someone linked to a bra fitting guide and said the section on widely splayed breasts was clearly made for men because women don't have breasts like that, and I'm literally sitting here with my super widely splayed breasts basically pointing different directions.

Can we be more careful about what we're deeming "male" characteristics? Because many, many women have breasts like I do. I've worked for decades to accept them, and it's such a slap in the face to come here and have women accuse me of being a man—just like my bullies in school did—all because my breasts are "too far apart".

The only thing that makes a male a man is having male genitals and an XY chromosome. Women also have wide breasts, large hands, wide shoulders, are tall, etc. It's so fucking tiresome to come here and on average 3-5 times a week see such ridiculously juvenile comments about how "only men have XYZ feature".

[–] RawSienna 10 points Edited

I’m sorry, I didn’t mean this to be hurtful to any woman. I have a physical characteristic more widely attributed to males and I know it’s annoying to have that commented on by others. Yes, I understand that an XY chromosome and male genitals makes a man, a man, but let’s not pretend that there aren’t huge, sex-typical physical appearance differences between the sexes at the population level. If these differences were not there, there would be no motivation for tims to fetishizes us. And breasts unfortunately happen to be a common object of fetishization.

Edit: clarified a thought.

I struggle with this site sometimes because the mocking based off appearances. I see a lot of mocking of TiMs for traits some women do have and have been made to feel bad about, like being 'too' tall, having wide set breasts or a boxy frames. It's really offputting. I understand a lot of the people here are hurting and angry, but attacking people based off their appearance is cruel and intellectually lazy.

Yeah, no matter how well they think they pass, their ribcage with fake boobs look so unnatural. Blaire White has a video tour of his home where you see him walking around and BOY does he not pass.

Lol clown-like is exactly my take, too. I hadn't even read your comment before posting. Right on.

On the GC reddit, there was a post about a TiM who came in as a guest lecturer to a women's studies class (I think in the late 80s or early 90s). One of the women attending noted the stark differences in the TiM's clothing: hose, pushup bra, fake nails (which were a lot rarer in the 90s than today), cake makeup, teased and hairsprayed do, high heels, mini skirt, ruffled blouse, etc. VERSUS the women students who were all in jeans, t-shirts with no makeup, flip flops or sneakers and hair short or up in ponytails. That's exactly how I remember college - casual clothes that weren't terribly dissimilar from the men.

Sounds like a dream. I went to Uni in the 2010s and many women made themselves up so, so much...

Same, my anxiety caused me to skip class a lot because I didn’t want to put in makeup or perform femininity

[–] Maplefields 38 points Edited

You make an excellent observation. I hope this would wake up women who are forcing themselves to suffer inconvenient clothes because they feel it’s expected of them.

Although, TiMs had nothing to do with me rejecting ridiculous women’s styles. During my teenage years, low rise jeans and mini skirts were in fashion. High school was spent seeing other girls’ butt cracks and nobody (except for petite girls) being able to find jeans with a rise high enough to adequately cover our derrières to be able to sit comfortably like human beings. Believe me, I tried. I visited several malls and went to every store and plaza outlet. It felt really ridiculous.

Then cold shoulder sweater tops came in style during my early 20s and I felt like I was trapped in the Twilight zone. I found nice sweaters but I couldn’t buy them because they had no shoulders. Functional clothes were apparently too much to ask for. That’s not even mentioning the fact that women’s pockets disappeared because using pockets would ruin the line of women’s clothes. It made me furious. This was years of frustration building up.

More infuriating was seeing Taylor Swift being mocked online for wearing high rise swimsuit bikini bottoms. They laughed at her, saying she looked like she was wearing granny panties. It cemented the fact that society treated women’s bodies as not deserving of dignity as human beings, our personal comfort with modesty to be ridiculed. Our purpose was to perform sexualized fashion. That women’s clothes didn’t serve the same purpose for women as they did for men. Men wore swim trunks and nobody laughed at them for choosing to cover more skin.

This is partially what lead me to start to learn to sew. I will not be victim to the whims of the fashion industry that sexualizes women’s bodies. I am a human being first, not some kind of art canvas. I need adequate clothes to protect me from the elements, like the cold and the sun, give me enough freedom to move and bend in regular life without being self-conscious and paranoid, and be made of a material that doesn’t itch and doesn’t feel like torture during the summer (polyester). (Also, I’ve noticed the fabric in men’s button-up shirts is of far better quality too.)

That’s not to say I reject nice looking clothes, but they should serve their functional purpose first. I will never again wear mini skirts that make me paranoid when taking the stairs or when the wind blows, high heels that impair you from enjoying life, and when high rise pants disappear (apparently low rise pants are coming back in fashion), I’ll be self sufficient to make my own.

I had a similar experience that led me to learn how to sew. I actually stopped wearing pants altogether around 2005 because the only kind I could find in stores were low rise, which does not suit my figure. I remember being in the women's underwear section trying to find regular underwear, and I literally could not find a pack because they were only selling ones designed to go with those low-rise jeans. I remember commenting on it to another woman who was also in a daze trying to find normal panties.

From then on, I decided to only wear dresses, or skirts with a blouse. I do wear yoga pant type leggings underneath to stop chub rub and for warmth in winter. My students have commented on it over the years. They really want me to have some kind of traditional old school religious reason for it. I just tell them, I don't like the way pants look or feel on me. I feel more comfortable in dresses and skirts. Changing to only skirts and dresses also coincided with a shift toward more modest and classic looks with florals and lace, though I am crazy about brightly colored Indian wrap skirts too.

I don't like that modern clothes don't keep off the elements, nor do they last very long, nor do they prevent lecherous perverts from getting an exact outline of every nook and cranny of my anatomy. I like women's clothes from older time periods, that are full of flounces, lace, crinoline, ribbons, etc. I feel beautiful wearing them, and connected to a long line of women who went before me. It sucks that lots of people (feminists included) have shit on me for my fashion, assuming I'm some kind of religious tradwife or brainwashed sheep. If I were walking around half naked putting on a show for the men I'd be liberated, right? But dressing like your grandmother did? I must hate myself!!! Lol nope I adore myself too much to let all these scrotes get a free peepshow.

Similar here, I have an ongoing battle with 'jeans' as I can never find them in a style that are long enough in the inside leg (yay for being tallish with curves) and often find it uncomfortable. Same with dress trousers etc, rarely do I find a pair that actually fits. So my work wardrobe and going out wardrobe are feminine but I prefer to edge toward 50s style as they tend to flatter me better.

Me too! I went through many years of only wearing skirts because I had no other option as I decided I wasn’t going to put up with low-risers anymore (and I don’t know if I’m alone but low-rise jeans hurt my hip bones). They made every pants low rise! Dress pants and not-jeans pants weren’t spared.

I’ve fallen in love with Palazzo pants and wrap pants since I tried them out. You might like them. They are as comfortable as skirts to me and they don’t display every nook and cranny of my body. There are certain weather conditions (cold+windy+rainy) when wearing maxi skirts are a hassle, so I prefer pants those times.

Yeah, those years were the worst- not a single store had normal pants!

I had never heard of wrap pants... do we need a fashion circle on here lol?

I just saw some highrise jeans called "the ribcage" or something like that (Levi's) lol. I don't think high rise will go anywhere, even if low rise becomes trendy again.

[–] Gladys_Kravitz 11 points Edited

I don't think it will ever be trendy again. Low rise jeans are the most uncomfortable garments on the planet.

I'd rather wear a tightlaced whalebone corset than low rise jeans cutting across my hip bones and turning my legs purple.

Yeah, I think at best they'll make a niche comeback among IG youth who are into that Y2K aesthetic. Big butts are still too popular and people aren't as anorexic as they used to be, I don't think anyone is prepared lol. Definitely will not outright replace high rise, I think they are here to stay.

Did the band also cause you pain to your hip bones? It did to me.

That’s good to hear. I was dreading the thought of sewing pants in a few years when mine eventually wear out. I don’t actually enjoy sewing. I view it as a life skill, just like I don’t like doing chores or cooking my meals. I’ve accepted that I have to make alterations to every pants I buy, but I don’t want to sew the whole pants from scratch.

I've always been critical of performative femininity, but TIMs really took it to the next level. Now I associate excessive performative femininity with something that is masculine, because I feel like only men enjoy that. There some fashion choices that is really hard for me to stomach, knowing that the purpose of it is only to serve men's eye.

[–] MenHaveItEasy Moid Respecter 26 points

I associate excessive performative femininity with something that is masculine

I love this. The further and further performative femininity looks like bimbos and drag queens, the more and more it becomes masculine. Like horseshoe theory. When I see it, I think this is how a man would dress a woman to get his rocks off.

The trans movement makes what femininity is- performing sexually for men, appealing to their beautification, objectification fetishes- extremely stark.

I want to believe that there has to be at least something about femininity that women can have solely for themselves, because I like the occasional "womanly" thing like painted nails or comfy dresses, but then I remember who's selling it to me :/ I still do those things occasionally, but far less than I used to.

I see photos of couples where the man is wearing a nice suit and the woman is wearing a sheer, uncomfortable, skin-tight dress with her makeup, hair and nails done and I just feel miserable at the discrepancy.

[–] zuubat 23 points Edited

Drag. Where we laugh at the contradiction between a person standing before us, a fellow human being, who should be taken seriously, respected, considered an adult capable of mature judgment ... decked out in attire, hair-do, make-up, and footwear that make him appear to be anything but. We recognize that contradiction far more easily when performative femininity is done by a man than when it's done by a woman. I think we all know why.

Yes, me too. I always was vaguely critical but couldn't really pinpoint it. Then I realized: the reason why men look ridiculous when wearing make-up, revealing clothes and heels is not just because those weren't cut for them (although that's also part of it). It's because they are literally clown costumes. Women don't look as ridiculous because we are so used to seeing ourselves in costume (as it is the only 'acceptable' way to be attractive), but it's still ridiculous-looking. And, well, really oppressive.

Same with shaving. I don't like men who shave their bodies, it's so unnatural. But now I also dislike seeing shaved women. It's so weird to constantly see hairless armpits on grown women. I find women with body hair so much more attractive.

[–] vulvapeople 10 points Edited

I'm not sure I've been looking at it as a whole more critically, but some things about their behavior and fashion choices have jumped out at me as being particularly silly, strange, or gross, and I find myself avoiding it.

For example, the way they clutch their purses to their bodies is an exaggerated mimicry of actual women. It looks so absurd when they do it (as if they're particularly vulnerable to muggers), I've started forgoing carrying a purse with me unless absolutely necessary. It helps that I rarely need more than my phone and keys with me most of the time.

Another example is the way they push their hair behind their ears. I'm sure they think it looks coy and shy, but it looks silly when they do it, which then makes me wonder if it makes girls and women also look silly. I feel glad, despite being a shy girl/woman, that I've never really done it myself.

I've never felt very comfortable in oversexualized clothes and have avoided them most of my life, and TIMs are retroactively helping me realize what a good choice that was.

Part of why they're not making me fully reassess all performative femininity is because I know they're doing it as a fetish, and most of my disgust toward them is due to that. It's also why I've reconsidered the idea that clothes are just clothes. That will only be the case when men stop treating what we wear as fetish gear.

Another example is the way they push their hair behind their ears

This reminds me of Blair White's weird way of running his nails through his hair lightly as if there's something sticky on his hair that he's trying not to get on his hands

I've rarely ever carried a purse. Now that I've tossed all the makeup for good Ive gone back to a slim style "wallet" with my essential cards and that's it.

[–] no- 26 points

Looking at TIMs is always weirdly inspiring. They're so proud of themselves for outfits, hair, and makeup women would get crucified for. When they prance around in skimpy outfits, it's with the same comfort men have when they lounge around shirtless, without the vulnerability women would feel in those same clothes. They make femininity seem so absurd and pointless, which it is. It makes you want to burn down everything femininity stands for and never look back, build something entirely different for women from scratch.

[–] Chopu 39 points Edited

Lol your post just reminded me of this hilarious batman meme:

https://twitter.com/juanbuis/status/1199651576236957697?s=20

And yeah, seeing men perform femininity drives home just how ridiculous it can actually be.

With women, we are just so used to seeing them with heels and makeup and uncomfortable and more revealing (compared to men's) outfits that we don't even bat an eyelid even if we see them wearing crop tops and heeled boots in the snow (instagram has been showing this a lot to me lately even though I keep clicking on 'not interested'😭). Edit: grammar

Okay that video was a perfect example and made me laugh. 😂

I agree it is due to desensitization that it is not always readily apparent how terrible so many of the social norms for women are. It reminds me of the phrase “beauty is pain,” but that you never hear the same about handsomeness.

That model swap had me rolling, might be my new favorite next to the Quiet/Ocelot swap from MGSV 😂

All these swaps are making me realize how female characters are objected not just in their clothing but also in the ridiculous way in which they walk and make weird porny expressions. Also that woman's itsy bitsy bra... Imagine running in that 😬

[–] Zola 11 points

wooooow. they have a woman dress like that and shower in a public room?

She's also literally unable to speak, and the creator said he designed her to see girls cosplay in her skimpy outfit. Just terrible on every level.

[–] bellatrixbells BoobatrixRex 13 points

I love how his first comment is "the video game industry desperately needs more women". Especially after someone posted about just this today.

Hilarious share though. Great.

Although...she does move a bit like my cats... Hahaha

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