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AltheaAugust 25, 2024
What's fascinating is that the left is generally quick to call Westerners out for viewing other countries through the lens of their own values (and sometimes they have a point). But I can't think of any more blatant example of this than claiming Afghan girls and women are oppressed because of their gender identity rather than their sex.
pennygadgetAugust 25, 2024
This is the biggest problem with far left and progressive people nowadays (especially the ones who fancy themselves "activists"). For all their talk about hating America and loving foreigners, they basically view other countries as "America. But with spicier food and silly accents". They don't understand that other countries have their own unique culture and problems that cannot be compared to the problems we have in the United States. Its why their "activism" often does more harm than good
redfem-radpillAugust 25, 2024
As an aside, I still feel that this stuff isn't really liberal or "left" (it's pretty authoritarian) as much as what I call the "prog" or "uberprog" left, the "look at me, I'm so progressive!" Hipper, cooler, better than everyone else. It's very performative. I used to sort of feel like the term applied to me as well as "liberal," but not anymore. I think I understand better now what they mean.
CaeruleaAugust 26, 2024
The left can be authoritarian too. I seem to recall several "socialist" dictators from my history books.
redfem-radpillAugust 27, 2024
Absolutely! But that's my point, of course. There are lots of authoritarian types on the extreme left side of the spectrum, but most people on the left side are not like them, and in fact they're really the opposite of liberal. It's like the way things turn into their opposites when they go to extremes. Authoritarian progs are a good example. The extreme right is also more authoritarian than the rest of the right, but the right seems a little more disposed toward going that way than the left does. It's what makes authoritarian leftists such a travesty. They really go against everything the liberal side is about. Bob Altemeyer did good stuff on this, though he calls the category "right-wing authoritarians" he's really talking about the whole tendency.
I'm just talking about activists here -- when we talk about actual dictators, I think they're all the same. They'll espouse any doctrine that will get them into power, it really doesn't matter what they claim to believe or represent. All they want is power, and they'll do anything, say anything, be everything to everyone, to get it, and then to hold onto it. Their doctrines don't really matter because everything is about power to them.
What's freaky to me in the activist realm is when people think they're super left and liberatory, when they're actually behaving in ways that work well in totalitarian states.
Louhi [OP]August 25, 2024
Absolutely. It's astonishing (like the OOP in my post, Helen Staniland would say ❤️)
CharliXXAugust 25, 2024
Absolute scum. Riddle me this, why the fuck don't they just identify as boys then? Is it their gender souls telling them they need to not receive education, bodily integrity or even the right to exist outside the kitchen?
The only people the West should allow refuge from this region are women, who are literally suffering under an apartheid. The males need to stay put and work out their issues.
notapatsyAugust 25, 2024
In fact, in Afghanistan, there is a tradition of raising a girl as if she were a boy. It's known as "bacha posh." A family will designate one of the girls to dress and live as if a boy. It does this precisely because it needs the prestige and freedom conferred by males. The girl herself is not the one who instigates this deception/practice, and often, when she reaches adolescence (reaches her childbearing years), the family revokes her previous status in order to marry her off. The journalist Jenny Nordberg wrote "The Underground Girls of Kabul," about the phenomenon. And there are several firsthand accounts by Afghan women who lived as if they were boys. The film "Osama" by the Iranian filmmaker Siddiq Barmak also explores this phenomenon.
To extrapolate from this and pretend that all girls choose to be girls ("identify" as girls) would be wrong. To impose gender ideology on Afghan girls and women, or indeed to women all over the world who suffer because of their femaleness is offensive.
[Deleted]August 25, 2024
So they give them a glance of the much better opportunities and treatment they can have and then snatch it away once all the hard work will pay off?
The TRAs should be careful with this Afghanis identifying as girls especially as the comparison of parents forcing their little kids’ identities for the own social capital even if it makes the kid’s life worse and more confusing come adulthood might have some parallels hmmm…
notapatsyAugust 25, 2024
Yes, that's right. The community goes along with the girl as boy, and treats her as if she's a boy. The girls grow up accustomed to male privilege and prestige, as well as freedom of movement, and those who must relinquish this status have the traumatic experience of having it all snatched away.
By the way, it's "Afghans" if you are referring to the Afghan people. "Afghani" is the unit of currency.
ILovePizzaALotAugust 25, 2024
Yeah, I think the purpose is so the "boy" can go out and do things for the family outside the home. It's purely utilitarian from my understanding.
PracticalMagicAugust 26, 2024
And necessary in a society where women aren't supposed to go out unaccompanied in many places, and a lot of the men are dead.
[Deleted]August 25, 2024
gcfemaleAugust 26, 2024
How doesn't this level of racism and cultural ignorance not peak mass amounts of people? Libfems disgust me.
[Deleted]August 25, 2024
I was just coming here to post this!!!!! great minds, no? lol
The entire article is def worth the read --PLEASE READ ME!
worried19August 25, 2024
There's an interesting documentary about this on YouTube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6r-LcDwzyg
I wonder how all those girls are faring now. The youngest one must be in her mid teens.
NastasyaFillipovnaAugust 25, 2024
Its soo sinister when you think about it. They are't even allowed to see a male doctor, and they're not letting women study at all, let alone be a doctor.
Too bad identifying as a boy won't make them not require access to a gynaecologist
Exactly
Ill take any women/ girls and any male children under 10
Any men and older boys need to lbe vetted and accepted under very conditional terms.
Be a scrote and get sent back
littleowl12August 25, 2024
No men, period. We've had too many dead women and girls giving them a chance.
They get to enjoy patriarchy, so they get to fight for their country. They often join militant groups even when in the West so they can do that over there and thunderdome it out.
Louhi [OP]August 25, 2024
Exactly this.
Enjoy your patriarchy bro? Cool beans. Go keep it up, then. Fuck off. Good luck with your manly endeavors of creating a half-functioning society while stripping 50% of population of their human rights. Bye.
I'm coming to this point of view. I just know it's hard for women to leave their sons
littleowl12August 26, 2024
I even have hesitancy to help the women. Many have true believer syndrome. Western women fought long and hard for our rights. We've done our work and continue to do our work. Now, in Europe, you don't even really have the right to not be raped/trafficked by these guys. The women protect these men. "Don't send him to jail! What about his wife and kids?!"
They don't go to jail, or if they do, very briefly. They don't get deported, because "what about his wife and kids?!"
The women think of us as dirty, hell-bound sinners too. A lot of them think we deserve how we're treated by their men.
Of course I want to help dissident women, but there just aren't that many. Even some who enjoy Western freedoms like Bushra Shaikh is an Islamist. What she does is throw other women under the bus, carving out a special position for herself where she can do things Muslims wouldn't allow her to do. It's an exchange for acting as a propagandist.
Here she is claiming Iraq is a very liberal, diverse, tolerant country.
https://x.com/Bushra1Shaikh/status/1827038226411835514
There is something really wonderful about Iraq. People are so nice. And soon as it is safer to do so, I would suggest visiting. The situation is still a little volatile and could deteriorate without warning. The KSI regions are currently the safest parts. Civil violence with foreign actors still plays a role. Women, local or other do not have to cover- yes, I was surprised too. Many do, others do not. Iraq has its conservative regions and more progressive parts, a blend of both. The Christian community, Chaldeans, Assyrians and others thrive among the Muslims. There is a growing English Expat community resident there too. Iraq is an emerging middle power strategically positioned.
This is the country that just legalized marrying 9 year old girls. She won't say who is being "volatile" and she doesn't mention that most of the Christian community has long since left Iraq. She doesn't mention Yezidis at all and I don't believe English people are retiring to Iraq. She probably means Muslims that resided in Britain, but that's it.
It's this kind of lying that makes me think she really shouldn't be in the UK. She's deliberately misleading the British public in a way that will harm them, but help Islamists.
Westerners should be saying "No, hard no, absolutely no, we will send you aid, but you will not set foot here."
Instead, all of this pleading and bullshit of "we're lovely family people, really" has brought stabbings, terrorism, trafficking, rape, vandalism, general bullying, basically colonization. Islam is a colonization program. You have to read their scripture, but that's what it is. There's no "render unto Caesar" to work with.
Any men and older boys need to lbe vetted and accepted under very conditional terms.
Be a scrote and get sent back
And, if we accept males from these places, they need to have VERY strict consequences if they fuck up. Rob a liquor store? Slap their girlfriend around? Be a nuisance to women on the subway? IMMEDIATE deportation! No slap on the wrist prison sentences and then being let back out to offend again
LillithAugust 27, 2024
I wonder about all of the women. They raised the men and they hold to a religious ideology which oppresses women.
I understand
I know that they enact many of the rules
But without the men they can believe as they like
Old r/gendercritical predicted this years ago already, in essence. The logical conclusion of this insane and misogynistic ideology is that women and girls choose to be a victim of the monstrous crimes that're perpetrated against them. It's nauseatingly despicable.
But it's all worth it for male lesbians, of course!
It’s disgusting. I hate what’s happening in western countries but I am grateful every single day that I was not born a woman in a Muslim country, or India, Pakistan or anything like that. To project our weird identity politics on to true oppression and imply that these poor women who were doomed at conception by their second X chromosome, are identifying into their own oppression is so despicable.
I hope this peaks some people, I mean Christ!
Don't want to get raped? Just stop identifying as a girl. Its always been so simple
/s
Sadly I remember from a long time ago a post about a TIF who tried to avoid her rape by saying that she's a man and that raping her would be gay. Obviously, and tragically, that didn't work.
There was a TIF who was raped by a taxi driver and protested the entire time that he couldn’t rape her because she was a man. There was a similar incident in a boarding house where a male resident harassed a female resident culminating in rape. She told the reporter that she just couldn’t understand how it happened because she was a man. Someone posted the article about the second incident on Ovarit.
Oh my fucking god. What a horrible disservice has been done to girls and women with this gender nonsense.
Aside from the fact that the whole "argument" is idiotic to begin with, can't males also be raped? Like, what gives?! Do these people ever listen to themselves?
When men want to rape women, they know exactly who is a biological woman.
I read somewhere that some of them are even pretending to be gay an dchasing TiFs to have sex, in the name of affirmation
some guys online openly brag about their grindr profiles where they state a preference for pre-op trans guys. they will call these dumb girls "bro" and get anal/head on the first date. i even read a post from a transman bragging about how she got to have sex with two guys on her first day on grindr.
woman, you could have always had sex with two disgusting internet strangers on the same day if that's what you wanted so bad.
I really don’t understand straight TIFs who consider themselves “gay”. Like, do they think that chasing gay men is somehow safer?! Do they think that straight men will somehow not recognize they’re women?! Like, straight men are not that dumb.
I despair. Jfc.
Rest assured that if there is a way to exploit vulnerable women, a man has already thought of it.
It’s like a bad middle school joke. But that shows how deep it runs for some of these TIPs. Some of them really do believe their own bullshit.
This is actually happening with child victims of SA. I have read girls state in their medical records that they wanted top surgery so that no one could ever touch her there again. Was able to get on hormones that visit and was approved for double mastectomy by 16.
Wasn’t there a whistleblower (not sure if correct term in this case) who went through the process of getting top surgery via Kaiser (without actually going through with it) and had deliberately put in a ton of red flags about how she was sexually abused and wanted to escape it, and she was approved no questions asked?
Yes, I think that was written about in Irreversible Damage
That's terrible. But it's not surprising. I have long been thinking that the amount of CSA perpetrated against girls has a lot to do with the numbers of them seeking transition. But it underlines how evil this whole thing is, that it's literally covering up the damage done and the fact that all that is happening, it's sweeping it under the rug -- while at the same time telling the victims that their psychological torment is not caused by the shit females get from society, but by being female itself. And because they've never encountered real feminism, and they're understandably desperate (plus their entire surround is shouting that it's all true all the time), they fall for it. Jump for it enthusiastically, even. And receive as the result terrible medical injuries that were never even a cure for their problem, but a fake solution they were tricked into taking. Multiple directions of evil.
Maybe someday we can mandate that all middle schoolers have to read Dworkin! Or something.
There was a letter that detransitioner posted from a therapist approving her for a double mastectomy at 14, all while knowing she was a victim of sexual abuse.
https://ovarit.com/o/GenderCritical/13790/therapist-s-referral-letter-for-top-surgery-on-a-14-year-old-sexual-abuse-victim
"Hey, Mr Rapist. I'll have you know that my pronouns are he/him! So it would be totally gay if you raped me!"
Honestly, if TIFs just started entering male weight lifting competitions and informing the weights that their pronouns are he/him, they could start dominating I’m sure
If the sign on the door wasn't stopping him, the he/him pronoun pin certainly will!!
It seems fairly disingenuous given that men rape other men all the time.
Yes, of course, it's our fault for identifying as sissy sluts and brood mares for thousands of years! We just love being oppressed!
Who knew it was so easy!