Every prison system has a special protection unit for inmates like pedophiles, police officers, gay men, etc. Facilities to keep TIMs safe exist.

I know a number of people who worked in prisons before the larping men could demand to be in womens prisons. They all observed the same things. Some of the larping men were gay guys but many were AGP het male transvestites. Those guys were the sexual predators in the mens prisons. Men avoided them because the larping men were the rapists.

If there were separate wings only for TIMs, I think the incidence of rape would be far greater than in regular mens prison.

Every MEN'S* prison in the state

Honestly, I think those who have been angling to get into women's prisons should all go to a TIM unit. That will teach them.

I've thought this from day one. They claim they want an escape from male prisoners, not access to "cis" female prisoners. Fine. Put them on a wing together. They'll be on a "female-only" wing then, won't they?

Wouldn't you agree?

No. Sorry but I don't feel the need to bend over backwards for inmates, especially not male ones. There's a million other things I'd rather see money spent on than accommodations for gender special men

That's not hard to believe, since rape is common in prison.

Is it, though? Men lie about rape - most commonly by saying "I didn't do it," but in particular sex offenders often claim to have been victimised in the past for sympathy points, only to renege when asked to take a polygraph. Why shouldn't other male criminals behave the same?

Just ship them to other states if needed

They need to have (probably already have) special wings for at risk men

Men with mental or physical disabilities, ‘snitches’, gay men, ex cops, TIMs

Even child molesters should be protected in prison, even if they don’t deserve to be protected in prison

I personally think we should just have one single prison for TIMs. Theres more than enough of these men to justify this.

I know it’s not feasible since these men are spread all across the country and it would be a waste of taxpayer dollars to cart them cross country for one single prison.

So yes. They need their own wing. Keep them out of the women’s prisons. `

All vulnerable men should be protected from rape in prison, not just the men who ID as trans. There should be a separate unit for feminine presenting men

This paper published in May 2024 is relevant.

The Present State of Housing and Treatment of Transgender Incarcerated Persons

Journal of the American Academy of Psychiatry and the Law Online

May 2024

The care and housing of transgender (TGD) incarcerated persons is a complex concern that is growing because of the increased recognition and diagnosis of gender dysphoria in society. To remain current in this evolving landscape, there have been updates to federal manuals and state guidelines regarding the medical care and housing of the TGD population.

Since the publication by Glezer and colleagues in 2013, there has not been a comprehensive overview of current federal and state guidelines, and legal and other considerations on this topic. We provide an update with special consideration given to housing practices, safety, and access to care.

A review of the literature shows that the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH) standards and Prison Rape Elimination Act (PREA) requirements are not uniformly implemented and enforced on a state level. In fact, some states have policies that are in direct conflict with federal requirements.

The safety and equitable treatment of both TGD and cisgender populations is an important topic that merits attention. As new challenges emerge, an increase in federal enforcement and consistency is needed to ensure the humane treatment and protection of TGD inmates.

Although only .5 to .6 percent of the adult population is TGD, TGD people are disproportionately represented in correctional settings.6,–,8

In 2014, Reisner and colleagues9 analyzed data from the National Transgender Discrimination Survey (NTDS), which was a survey distributed to the largest convenience sample of TGD adults in the United States to date. Out of 3,879 TGD women, 19.3 percent reported histories of incarceration, in comparison to less than three percent of the general population.

Black and Native American TGD women were more likely to report a history of incarceration than White, non-Hispanic respondents.

Prison Rape Elimination Act

The Prison Rape Elimination Act (PREA)16 was enacted in 2003 after a congressional inquiry was launched into sexual assault in the correctional system. PREA standards are intended to align practices across local, state, and federal institutions to eliminate sexual violence in prisons. The standards were implemented in 2012 and have jurisdiction over both state and federal correctional facilities, including privately operated facilities.17 The standards include sections on prevention of sexual violence, responsive planning, training and education, screening for risk of sexual victimization and abusiveness, reporting, official response following report, investigations, discipline, and compliance.

PREA contains 13 provisions specifically addressing TGD inmates, which are outlined in Table 1

With respect to housing and classification, there are three recommendations about using information on gender identity to assign a TGD inmate to a particular facility: decisions should be made on a case-by-case basis; decisions should be reassessed twice per year; and the TGD inmate’s own views should “be given serious consideration” (Ref 17 §115.42). TGD inmates should be able to shower separately and not be placed into involuntary segregation solely because of their LGBT status.16

LGBT inmates should not be segregated into separate facilities, as this separation can be stigmatizing, lead to a decrease in access to programming and recreation, and in some cases be synonymous with solitary confinement, which causes psychological distress and has been recognized as a form of inhumane punishment.18,–,21

[However], PREA does allow an exemption of this statute under a consent decree or settlement agreement. For example, the K6G unit of the LA County Men’s Central Jail has been operating since 1985 and described as an affirming and humanizing alternative for LGBT inmates.22,23

only Indiana contained all 13 of the PREA provisions addressing TGD inmates, and only one-quarter of state policies included most of the provisions.

40 percent of states had policies that were incompatible with the TGD-related PREA provisions.

For example, Hawaii and Idaho have blanket policies to house inmates based on their sex assigned at birth; and segregation or “protective custody” based on TGD identity is still commonly used in the District of Columbia, Virginia, and Oregon. Overall, the PREA provision least commonly included was the one preventing the use of segregation based solely on LGBT status.24

States not in compliance with PREA regulations must forfeit five percent of federal funding provided to the state correctional department unless the state can provide assurances that it is using the federal funds to work toward compliance. According to the Bureau of Justice, as of 2020, 21 states and the District of Columbia were fully compliant with PREA, and 30 provided assurances of working toward compliance.25 Only two states (Alaska and Utah) provided neither. At the time of writing, Alaska was planning to provide an assurance, leaving Utah as the only state that continues to refuse the implementation of PREA.

Some Relevant US Court Rulings

The United States Appeals Courts have ruled differently with respect to inmate claims of Eighth Amendment violations for failures to conform policy to PREA guidelines. For example, in Williams v. Kincaid,26 the Fourth Circuit held that gender dysphoria is a protected disability under the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) and is different from its original exclusion of gender identity disorder. The diagnosis of gender identity disorder was excluded as qualifying as a disability in 42 U.S.C. § 12211.

The court also held that Kesha Williams, a TGD woman imprisoned in Virginia in a men’s facility, had been discriminated against and that the prison’s blanket policy of housing inmates by genital status was in direct contravention of federal regulations under the Prison Rape Elimination Act that require determination be made on a case-by-case basis.

[However, in the Williams case] Justice Quattlebaum dissented and argued that gender dysphoria was similar enough to gender identity disorder to be exempt from the ADA. He also argued that Sheriff Kincaid was not grossly negligent, as she demonstrated some degree of care in attempting to balance housing decisions with safety concerns of cis-gendered female inmates and correctional staff.

In Rivera v. Bonner,27 the Fifth Circuit held that while PREA was a helpful guideline, it did not establish a constitutional obligation for institutions to conform their policies and training to PREA.

Housing is Matter of Social Controversy

Despite the very small number of TGD inmates who are housed based on their gender identity,28 it is currently a matter of social controversy. In March 2023, Republican lawmakers introduced the “Preventing Violence Against Female Inmates Act of 2023” in the U.S. Senate and House of Representatives that would prohibit such housing in state and federal correctional institutions.29 The case of a New Jersey trans woman impregnating two inmates garnered significant media attention and raised important considerations for such housing decisions, including the realities of consensual sexual interactions in such facilities, the difficulties of discerning consent in institutional settings, and the lack of available condoms in U.S. prisons and jails.30

Safety is an important factor in housing decisions, especially because TGD inmates are at considerably higher risk of physical and sexual violence than the general population.44

Safety should also extend to protecting other inmates from potential violence perpetrated by a TGD individual.

For example, there may be concern about the risk of victimization from an inmate assigned male at birth transitioning to female who is housed in a female facility.

PREA includes standards that mandate screening to assess TGD inmates’ vulnerability to attacks as well as the risk that they themselves will be physically or sexually abusive toward other inmates. It states, “The initial screening shall consider prior acts of sexual abuse, prior convictions for violent offenses, and history of prior institutional violence or sexual abuse, as known to the agency, in assessing inmates for risk of being sexually abusive” (Ref. 16, § 115.41).

The 2022 Manual includes provisions on initial housing screening and transfer requests protecting “the wellbeing of all inmates” (Ref. 2, p 6), which specifically incorporates the inmate’s “criminal and behavioral/disciplinary history” and “likelihood of perpetuating abuse” (Ref. 2, p 6). On a state level, no comprehensive literature search has been published to date about specific protections afforded to cisgender inmates or the incidence of violence against the cisgender population.

Housing and Safety

The 2022 Transgender Offender Manual2 incorporates the thirteen PREA provisions related to TGD inmates. The manual states that housing should be considered on a case-by-case basis with some consideration given to the inmate’s own gender identity. TGD inmates must have the opportunity to shower separately from the general population. It also establishes that TGD inmates cannot be placed in dedicated wings based on their gender identity unless established by separate legal action (e.g., consent decree) for safety purposes. If an inmate is transitioning, transfers to facilities concordant with their gender identity are considered upon the condition that the inmate has been compliant with programs, medications, and mental health treatment and is meeting hormone goal levels. These guidelines are consistent with PREA requirements.

As noted in our discussion of PREA implementation, states vary considerably in their implementation of the housing and safety standards, without recognizable patterns. For example, as of 2018 only Indiana contained all 13 provisions.24 About half of the states contain at least seven; for example, California had seven, New York had eight, and Texas had 11.24 A quarter of the states had less than four of the provisions.24 Florida, Indiana, Illinois, and Mississippi contained no accessible data about their policies at the time of publication.24

Safety is an important factor in housing decisions, especially because TGD inmates are at considerably higher risk of physical and sexual violence than the general population.44 Safety should also extend to protecting other inmates from potential violence perpetrated by a TGD individual.

For example, there may be concern about the risk of victimization from an inmate assigned male at birth transitioning to female who is housed in a female facility.

PREA includes standards that mandate screening to assess TGD inmates’ vulnerability to attacks as well as the risk that they themselves will be physically or sexually abusive toward other inmates. It states, “The initial screening shall consider prior acts of sexual abuse, prior convictions for violent offenses, and history of prior institutional violence or sexual abuse, as known to the agency, in assessing inmates for risk of being sexually abusive” (Ref. 16, § 115.41).

The 2022 Manual includes provisions on initial housing screening and transfer requests protecting “the wellbeing of all inmates” (Ref. 2, p 6), which specifically incorporates the inmate’s “criminal and behavioral/disciplinary history” and “likelihood of perpetuating abuse” (Ref. 2, p 6).

On a state level, no comprehensive literature search has been published to date about specific protections afforded to cisgender inmates or the incidence of violence against the cisgender population.

Ongoing Challenges: Safety

The topic of physical and sexual violence perpetuated by the TGD individual against the general population is controversial. It merits consideration, especially in the case of male to female facility transfers. The Eighth Amendment imposes a duty on prison officials to “protect prisoners from violence at the hands of other prisoners” (Ref. 45, p 825). This duty not only applies to protecting the TGD individual, but also the general population against possible violence committed by the TGD person. There are no readily accessible data on the incidence of such violence or the extent to which it is a problem.

An Illinois case demonstrates these safety concerns. Janiah Monroe, a TGD woman, allegedly raped a cisgender woman after being transferred to a female prison despite pretransfer concerns about her risk of violence.46 Ms. Monroe was transferred from a male to a female facility in 2019 after she successfully sued the Illinois Department of Corrections alleging that she was sexually assaulted while housed in a male facility.47,–,49

There was considerable controversy surrounding Ms. Monroe’s transfer to female housing; prison officials raised concern about whether she was psychiatrically stable based on her previous attempts at suicide and efforts to castrate herself.50,51 There was additional concern regarding her history of serious violence; she had been incarcerated since 2005 after shooting two people outside of a barbershop and was later convicted of murder after strangling her cellmate in 2006.50,51

It should be noted that some of the rape allegations made by the cisgender woman were later retracted.50 Nonetheless, the case illustrates a potential example of the possible risk of TGD inmates to the safety of others.

https://jaapl.org/content/early/2024/05/08/JAAPL.240020-24

Prisons already have special wings set aside for prisoners who are at an elevated risk of assault from others (ie former cops, informants, celebrities, very elderly or disabled, etc). The TIMs can just go there

Men’s prisons don’t need a dedicated TIM wing though. They can already go to where prisons place the vulnerable gay men and disabled men. I suppose they could put a sign up on that wing and rename it for “TIMs & Vulnerable Men” to make it more affirming or some bullshit 🤪

I have a feeling the transgender prisoner population would wildly decrease if they no longer could get into the ladies. In fact, I'm pretty sure it would be the ACLU definition of genocide!!

Yeah, prisons and jails. Jails are for people who have not yet had their day in court. It's terrible what was happening at Riker's in NY. People do need a timely trial, not wait two years. I also believe the families of the incarcerated have the right to not have to travel really far to speak to their loved one during visiting hours. Some men, really do reform in prison. Take Malcolm X who self-educated himself while incarcerated. I clearly don't agree with everything the Nation of Islam was doing, but they also kicked Malcolm X out.

edit: Oh, I'll also say, listen to Patty's Podcast about the prisons in Ireland. http://paddyspodcast.ie/ What recent female inmates say about TIMs is staggering.

I disagree. They do belong in with all the other men because they are men. No one should be coddling them in any way.

Also, do you really believe they aren't going to rape each other? Why do you assume they'll be the victims rather than the perps? Do you actually believe their rhetoric? They only claim they'll be the victims as an excuse to get moved to the women's.

Think of the smell

I heard some ex con HSTS say he didn't want to go to female prison because he wouldn't be able to have a boyfriend. No idea how accurate that is.

A wing just for TIMs would effectively serve as a woman's prison, if TIMS are indeed women, right?

Just brand it as "special womens protection unit" or something. Dont say trans.

The logic holds up. They want their gender recognised, and to be away from dangerous males. Cool, by your logic heres an all-woman wing. Im not even sure how they could complain about it without being transphobic.

I agree. They should definitely have their own space. And if anyone has any complaints or making arguments about not enough prisoners for one state facility or wing? then make a national prison center for TIMs. They can all fuck themselves there.

Edit: That or keep them with their on male kind. Men's facilities are fine for them. Get rid of violence in men's prisons across the board. That is the bigger issue that needs to be addressed.

They already have one.

Boom.

They already have spaces for people on suicide watch