Rave because I can now confidently say that no, it's not just a few terminally online redditors or some twitter activist that most people don't part, this is being used in an actual tribunal case by a doctor.

Tribunal conversations here: https://substack.com/home/post/p-154549697

C/SP - Claimant, Sandy Peggie

NC - Naomi Cunningham, C’s barrister

R2/DU - second respondent, Dr B Upton

JR - Jane Russell, KC, barrister for respondents

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 2):

NC - you describe yourself as TW, so born male, male body

(this next line might have been NC referring to DU (so a misattribution), but this is how it was transcribed)

DU - so you are a man and you wish to be seen as a woman

JR - there are lots of questions there, one at a time.

NC - you are a TW, not a Cis woman

DU - yes

NC - don't have a female body

DU - that has no definition, I'm female and I have a body so biologically female

But oh boy you really should ready your bingo cards while reading though all these. Here are some good ones:

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 2):

DU - TW woman assigned male at birth and wishes to live as a woman.

NC - how does assignation happen?

DU - look at body make a best guess if they can, not always clear, I'm not an obstetrician

NC - never suggested you have a DSD?

DU - I;ve provided a comprehensive answer

NC - so no DSD, for most it takes no expertise.

DU - no legal status

NC - it's an observation a 5 year old can make

DU - 5 year olds are quite different, not a marker of intelligence just age

I say we let Youngest have a go at this one

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 1):

NC - Pete doesn't have to do anything other than be in there to create an intimidating and humiliating environment for the nurse?

DU - he could be a plumber come to fix the toilet, that's not the same, Pete changing or being in the space are not the same.

NC - we have already said he comes in seeing her undressed and is now undressing in the room.

DU - Pete is doing something, undressing knowing

DU - she's uncomfortable, what are you saying

The plumber argument?!? I really don't know who programmed them all to use this one, as maintenance generally doesn't happen while others are using the restroom, and if it is and it's impossible to get a female, there can be a female observant to ensure that the plumber sticks to business and makes no detours.

Monday 10th Feb afternoon session (Pt 1):

NC a number of w using that CR may hold the view that you need a large gamete and small gamete person to produce babies.

DU I'm sure there are people who believe those things. Doesn't make them right or allowed to disrespect people who thing otherwise.

NC W who believe can't change sex - you and board have sacrificed them.

DU No. I'm not the board. There is a challenge to work out best way of dealing. I am a woman and can use the CR. If I'm talking to a homophobe they may believe negative things about me and my wife.

Sandy Peggie has a lesbian daughter. Upton is a straight male.

By the way, they already tried to smear Peggie as a homophobe earlier in this (Thurs 4th Part 2)

Monday 10th Feb afternoon session (Pt 1):

DU Physically free, yes.

NC How tall

DU 6 ft

NC SP is 5ft 6. F, She couldn't intimidate you.

DU I'm a woman.Not just on physical attributes. And able to be intimidated even so. My grandmother was small and intimidating.

woman is when easily intimidated (but also women are scary)

(Note the subtle revisionist history here of always being a woman)

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 1):

NC - hoping for Y/N answers, with ability to explain later.

JR - sorry witness can explain

NC - I don't pretend I can limit answer, it's open to do so,..

J - witness can answer as sees fit

NC -no mention of medical treatment so you don't think that is what makes a woman

DU - don't think trans identity is contingent on treatment for anyone, just as a cis woman couldn't be barred from F CR if she has a hysterectomy.

NC - not tld C lawyer or tirbunal if you hold a GRC, so that doesn't make a difference either?

DU - don't think a GRC is needed for

DU - transpersons identity to be respected.

NC - is the difference that Pete has a beard and short hair, and you shaved yours and grew yours?

DU - I don't think the beard is relevant, there are cis women with facial hair, a butch lesbian can have masculine appearance

if a female has a hysterectomy, she's still a female. Getting your dick flayed doesn't change your sex, either.

Wonder if he still has his penis

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 1):

NC - so what is it that makes you a woman?

NC - is it that you say you are a woman?

DU - if people are sincere about how they want to move through the world I don't see why that shouldn't be respected.

NC - does it follow from these answers about build, hair, clothes, speaking all can vary independently of GI

NC - does if follow that big bearded manly looking Pete is able to say I'm a GNC woman?

DU - I can't say how Pete feels. If that were the case, like for any GNC women there would be challenges. like for any GNC person there would be challenges.

NC - do you say if Pete sincerely

NC - believes he's a GNC woman, no surgery, no GRC, no treatment, no presentation - it seems you are saying if he says he's a GNC woman I want to use the F CR that would be his right?

DU - if Pete was a real person I think it would prompt tricky conversations about what we view

DU - as a women and expectations and as a trans person in a transphobic Society, trans people are not unaware of what they look like.

I want to move through the world as a lot of things, but people can't even be fucked to respect my love for sticking to a routine schedule and planning events well in advance.

Monday 10th Feb morning session (Pt 1):

NC - he wouldn't be the first bearded man to say he is expanding the bandwidth of what it means to be a woman.

JR - is this a

JR - specific person?

NC - don't need to go further.

I wonder who NC could be referring to, truly a mystery, can someone help me out on this one?

I also don't get how JR realizes that this all could be applicable to a specific individual

Really, though, you should just read the entire thing.