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There's a whole thing happening right now about wanting a metoo moment for the music industry, and specifically rap. Women are getting fed up by being told it's racist to talk about it .These men are singing about raping and beating women, even children. Their own hatred of women, and specifically black women is abhorrent, but everyone is told to shut up and sit down. Black women are guilted about trying to tear their own down, what happened to Megan Thee Stallion comes to mind.
And this is just one aspect of how this manifests. Everywhere men are prioritized, on the basis of sex, race, disability, mental health etc. Women will never be put first unless we put ourselves first. If men are truly facing some sort of oppression then other men can help them. But we as women need to stop helping them. They get nowhere without us, even with their own causes. They would never succeed without unpaid and uncredited women's labour, and then when it comes to "our" time, suddenly it's not important. Every single point in history this has happened.
Prison abolitionism is also another male pet project that goes nowhere without women's support, and yet we never talk about women's prisons. Most males deserve to be in prison, in fact they actively get slaps on the wrist and let off scott free. For crimes women would get 20 to life for. Most women in prison do not deserve to be there, the penal system is harsher on women. Women's crimes are not tolerated, and it serves as a deterrent to other women, because the so called crimes are usually self defense or "accessory" on account of dating or being near a man who actually commited the crime.
And whenever a Black woman did complain about the misogyny in the rap music industry, she was dismissed as a pearl-clutching prude and openly mocked
Amen many times over.
Will never forget watching a documentary on women’s prisons in which the male warden remarked, utterly matter-of-factly, that most of the inmates did not belong there, did not deserve incarceration. Please note: not some, not half, but most.
I remember a story about a man who murdered his daughter, I think they wanted to give him 10 yrs. The jury however decided that the mother was evil incarnate and should get 17, all because she was asleep at the time. She committed no crime, had no idea and suffered because of it. Lost a daughter and then got more time then that pig. Sickening.
I listened to a npr report on the conspiracy statute, many of the women in jail for this ended up there due to the actions of their boyfriends, in many cases they were doing way more time than their boyfriends who had actually committed the crimes they were supposedly in conspiracy for. It was so enraging.
Only yesterday on Twitter I saw a comment saying that if Kamala Harris doesn’t want black men to vote for Trump then she needs to introduce policies friendly to black men like abolishing child support and alimony but also automatically give them 50% custody. Fancy seeing yourself as a victim because you have to pay a few dollars for your own child.
Agreed with your point, and wanted to add — presumably that commenter considers themselves liberal (correct me if I’m mistaken), yet the sentiment that “black men specifically would benefit from policies that allow them to be bum fathers” is mind bogglingly racist to me
Yeah I was running to the comment box to point out that slimey lil nugget 😄
It's so absurd that I thought it must have come from a parody account, but so many people are parodies now that it's impossible to tell without wasting a great deal of time investigating them.
Oh my god some of these people need to be shipped off to deep space. Not to mention how fucking racist that sounds. Basically reads like “since black men are even worse than the average man and abandon their kids at even higher rates and are too fucking broke and/or lazy and/or selfish to bring any material benefit into the kids’ life, a black-male-friendly policy involves letting them do whatever the fuck they want to harm black women and don’t say boo about it.”
she needs to introduce policies friendly to black men like abolishing child support and alimony
It's already a stereotype that they pay neither so good job suggesting we legislate it that way.
but also automatically give them 50% custody.
Ime, the same dads who don't wanna pay child support are the same ones that won't pick up their kids every other weekend. Most men only go for custody when they have a new partner or female relative they can hand all the parenting chores to.
I suppose this has the added bonus of punting black women further away from financial security and job progression if they become sole providers for any black children. More black babies being aborted in possibly risky procedures and in future black women being encouraged to only have kids with men of other races who I assume would still have to pay alimony.
Stunning! Brilliant! Not racist at all! /s
In fact, I’d say this might actually be a good definition of misogynoir.
black women being encouraged to only have kids with men of other races who I assume would still have to pay alimony.
And when those black women pursue non-black partners to protect themselves from these stupid laws, people will give them shit for being traitors.
Harris wrote a love letter to Jacob Blake. So its no wonder shitty men think she'll simp for them
The thing that gets me regarding child support abolishing or reform is that the kid is going to be supported somehow through the state if this happens, so everyone’s taxes would be going up to support the actions of a few amoral men. You can bet everyone without child support payments would be super pissed about this, it’s the dumbest issue in the world from a political sense. Dudes with mandated child support aren’t oppressed, they’re idiots.
I remember Oxfam blaming "privileged white women" for supporting the root causes of sexual violence for wanting sex offenders jailed because it disproportionately affected minorities.
Basically says women should shut up about their rapes in case a minority man went to jail.
Sadly, I've seen far too many incidents where my white friends, who 9 times out of 10 would NEVER put up with the slightest hint of disrespect or sexual harassment from a man, shrink back and put up with blatant sexual harassment from MOC.
They were so afraid of being labeled as "racist," they'd downplay the severity of the harassment, say "I don't want to make a big deal out of it," and even make excuses defending HIM.
Especially during the height of BLM, white women in liberal spaces are constantly told that MOC, especially black men, could literally be killed if a white woman made even the slightest fuss. But if that's true, wouldn't they, I dunno, be a LOT more careful around white women if their lives were truly on the line?
And if this was how they treated white women in public, how are they treating WOC in their own communities behind closed doors?
But if that's true, wouldn't they, I dunno, be a LOT more careful around white women if their lives were truly on the line?
For real. If it were true that white women could magically summon a group or angry policemen every time they cried, no White women would ever get raped or murdered. And no black men would go near her. Its all a ploy to keep women silent and prevent them from calling out inappropriate behavior
Great points. Every famous black athlete has a white female partner, so they cant be that scared of them.
I will never get over the Swedish gov't actually saying Swedish women "over-reported" rapes committed by minorities due to racism.
I don't care about being called racist or whatever. Most black men are vile, just as much as any other male. The femicide rates in the black community, the overall violence, that's all the males. White men aren't forcing them to commit crimes, single mothers aren't either. If that were true, black women would be just as violent. All males behave like this when they feel helpless. Since black men are disenfranchised by white men, they pick on weaker prey I.E women, because they failed at maleness. They get zero sympathy for me, same for the Indian men crying racism while not addressing their sexism. Males care more about their public image, while not putting in the work to change that image by just being good people.
John McWhorter calls this the "Bad Ass Motherfucker" phenomenon. It's not exclusive to black males at all, though.
I was in a choir once with an Asian teacher. He said being an Asian boy in America is the hardest thing because you’re invisible. The girls at least get attention for being considered attractive (fetishized). There were a few Asians there, one Asian boy had just won a music Grammy, it was ridiculous. The silence in that room reeked.
That was a wtf moment. How the hell did he consider being fetishized better? What an ass!
It’s always men saying these things and putting themselves first, crying about not being able to get laid by other races.
I really wish people could study intersectionality and think critically about it, but the truth is, when it becomes mass knowledge, everyone’s gonna be misusing the theory for their own interests, quite badly. In reality all intersectionality did was make women get sidelined and shut up all over again, while only conceding a voice to the weakest women who struggle to defend themselves, and a bunch of whiney men along the way.
Well-intentioned social theories always cause unintended consequences. Any movement that decenters women will cause exactly that.
The girls at least get attention for being considered attractive (fetishized).
Men just seriously do not get or simply do not care about what women go through. I've heard that same thing from men in other groups as well. Multiple times I've heard gay men say that lesbians have it so much easier than they do because "at least straight men think lesbians are hot" as if that's somehow a good thing? Men only see things from their point of view. They don't know (or care) what it's like to be objectified like women are, so to them it's just a fun, sexy time. Somehow they see fetishization/objectification as "acceptance" rather than dehumanization.
Men always say they would "love" to be fetishized, but in the rare incidents where it does happen, suddenly it's not so fun anymore.
Look at Matt Rife who rose to fame with a largely female audience base and classically handsome looks that HE pursued with surgery.
He couldn't handle the fact that he got famous due to being "fetishized" by his female fan base and he completely turned on them during his first Netflix special.
Someone I knew in college used to put up highly sexualized pictures and posters of guys on her wall. She remarked how interesting it was when guys would come over and say things like
She thought it was hilarious.
He couldnt even handle being fetishized by women? He should see what it feels like when bigger, stronger men are talking about what they want to do with his body parts.
I think that's the core of Mridul Wadwha's obsession with white women. He views them from a pornographic lens and wishes men would view him that same way. That's why he likes to work jobs where he's paid to psychologically mess with vulnerable women in white areas.
Yep always been the men who make fun of them for being ‘pretty boys’ and always the women who get seethed at when the star gets tired of trading on his looks.
Something that took me a long time to get around is that many men consider pornography... fun. I don't mean erotic, dark, private, questionable. No: Fun. I was reading a gay man's substack once blaming pornography for some of the gender stuff nowadays, and the whole article was about how pornography can be very fun and sometimes too fun. I'm like... what??? Is this what gay men think? Is this seriously their biggest problem? That they're having "too much fun" with porn?? Never would I ever consider it "fun". The first time I saw such a site, it was gross, ugly, violent, and somewhat terrifying. Even as an adult the last time I saw it I just cannot even fathom how the heck it is "fun" to see a bunch of cocks and underpaid actors flying around. Sure, I'm a lesbian. It's insane how so many gay men don't even have two brain cells to fathom how a lesbian does not want to be perceived or "accepted" that way by men.
I was listening to a podcast by Gender: A Wider Lens and the female psychotherapists were saying how it's weird to see men associate femininity in sex as inherently degrading and submissive as sissy porn reveals - a concept completely foreign and weird to her. All of this is inside the male brain and the male brain only.
"at least straight men think lesbians are hot"
That’s so strange. So what if they do? Is the implication that they’re jealous of these lesbians? Straight men are straight. They won’t find any man hot because they’re straight… that’s why they’re straight.
I think it's partly jealousy + mistakenly thinking that some straight men finding lesbians hot is somehow a form of acceptance. A lot of gay men think that lesbians don't face homophobia to the extent that gay men do (or that we even face homophobia at all), and often this is part of their "proof." They don't seem to realize or care that some straight men fetishizing and debasing lesbians isn't acceptance -- it's disrespectful and dehumanizing. There's just such a huge disconnect because they don't get it and/or don't care.
I’ve heard Asian men cry about this too, about being “emasculated” in media. Sir the existence of that concept proves that misogyny is the actual problem here.
Black men do it, too. They see black actors wearing dresses as an upfront to their masculinity, while they don't see it as mocking black women. Also, drag is not exclusive to them. All males make fun of women through drag. They just want to be a perpetual victim so badly.
They see black actors wearing dresses as an upfront to their masculinity
Cough Tyler Perry cough
I will not hear it from the highest paid men in America how haaaaaaard it is to be invisible.
I hate how intersectionality has been abused by SJWs and professional victims.
Yeah but Asian men fetishise Asian women too so they can’t imagine it’d be that bad for them 🙄
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I highly recommend listening to Dr Suzanne Vierling on this topic (specifically, her appearance on the Female Dating Strategy podcast). She is a Black woman who has worked to get young women out of street prostitution. And she doesn't pull punches about how these supposed "Black rights" movements center men and ignore the needs of Black women (or outright make their lives worse by coddling Black male abusers)
missed that episode. I know what my gym listen will be today
Yep I just commented this on your other thread. Women suffer the most when “intersectionality” causes direct conflicts and we are always expected to acquiesce for fear of being called sexist, racist, xenophobic, transphobic etc.
The Combahee River Collective is the resource for this conversation--so important! And yet no one in GWS even teaches it anymore--hell, I don't think the profs now have read it or heard of it. I also like The Bridge Called My Back.
"This Bridge Called My Back" is such a founding text. And it is still being taught in WS, at least at my university.
Barbara Smith (of the Combahee River Collective) came to speak at my university about five years ago. She was full of praise for the TIM Janet Mock, who had touted her influence. (You can watch the clip on youtube if you google Janet Mock and Barbara Smith.) It made me sad that even Barbara Smith had been captured.
They all are. it is sickening and one of the many reasons I left the academy when I did, esp as a GWS prof.
Interesting read thanks, bit disappointing it ends with women being held to a much higher standard than men who basically get off the hook but I suppose some things never change.
I think it comes out of the rad fem insight that men aren't going to give up their power, so we cannot rely on them to change. And that the feminist movement cannot depend on men's changing for anything.
Black women have been trying to voice this concern for ever. Black Lives Matter has always been Black Mens Lives Matter; anytime a Black woman tries to speak up about sexual violence she is told to take a seat in case she makes Black men look bad. Look what happened to Alice Walker.
It's not Black womens burden to put up with abuse from Black men in silence because Black men suffer from racism. Black men also think it's fair game to shit on white women for their whiteness when they were handed the vote before white women and white women aren't even responsible for the laws that made them second class citizens. I have about as much time for them as white men, which is none.
I will always support Black women speaking out.
I frequently think about this whenever these kind of things come up. I don’t think people realize…. Black men were given the right to vote before women of any race in America. Not that it really matters ultimately, I mean it used to be that you could be white and male and still not be able to vote if you didn’t own land, but I always think that’s worth considering whenever someone wants to engage in a “who’s more oppressed” pissing contest. Obviously the situation is nuanced, but still